Jace calls JOOOOOSH, rants incomprehensibly about how he is White Tupac.

[Germanicus]

I disagree, it is partly her fault, because instead of getting him some professional help she keeps sending him to Jesus camp, which only makes things worse.

 

[Alex Krycek]

Sure he needs to leave, and I encourage him finding some kind of faith or lack thereof. He should be more realistic though. Even if he can live in EliCottage that won't help him. Go out and get a job, get a licence, get your anger under control, but from what I've seen Gail isn't really at fault. She's an overwhelmed single mom who is likely a born-again that fell victim to raising her son vs. making sure he had a roof. His mental patterns haven't helped at all and yeah he's nutty as hell. I'm just not feeling the vibe that she's a Borb in this situation per se.

 

[Varis]

So... it sounds like Jace just left the cats in the cottage, and if Gail is keeping him on a leash, nobody is taking care of them.

 

[BriarHeart]

It's stupid to blame him mom for this. We don't know the facts of the situation. Jace clearly has issues. Newsflash: some people are just messed up. How do you think his mom feels having a crazy son? People keep saying "religious" mom as if her not being religious would help Jace.

There is no one but Jace to blame for his insanity, and if that is a result of natural mental illness, then blame nature.

Obviously we all hope things work out for everyone and that Jace keeps it together and ends up having a happy, normal life, but I always read on here people putting blame onto his mom, which I think is just wrong.

Not that it matters because we're all just spewing crap on an internet forum so whatever.

Sorry in advance, but I couldn't disagree more.

Considering that Gail thinks that Bible study, a stint at a "Jesus camp" with no psychological credentials, and a fucking exorcism are going to cure the "demons" of paranoid schizophrenia, and also considering that she continues to isolate Jace and mismanage his condition, it's a lot more than "some people are just messed up."

Religiosity, extreme or otherwise, can lead to irrational and even harmful behavior, especially when the religiosity of a parent is imposed on a sick, disabled, or otherwise impaired child. In this case, Gail not being religious would give her no reason to keep Jace away from qualified doctors and case workers in favor of untrained pastors and camp counselors, but her being religious gives her plenty of reasons. Horrible, shitty reasons, but the possibility of being wrong doesn't even occur to the true believer, because their religion and their methods are always, always right.

It's true that "some people are just messed up," since biology plays a big part in mental illness, but coping skills for mental illness don't grow up in a vacuum. Do you think that Chris would have turned out to be the shitstorm he is today if his autism had been properly recognized and treated by supporting parents? Of course not. I'm not saying that Jace isn't responsible for his current actions, because he is, but Gail is likewise responsible for hers. You can't whitewash the harm done to him over the years by Gail, and you can't deny that her religiosity increased said harm many times over.

As for how Gail "feels" about having "a crazy son," that's irrelevant. She is the parent and Jace is the child, and considering his condition, she is still his legal guardian. If she was a decent mother with an ounce of actual love, then she should feel something like "My poor child, you have a legitimate medical condition. That is nothing to be ashamed of. I will do everything I can to educate myself on the realities of your illness, take the advice of trained professionals, and do whatever I can to get you the help that you need to live a healthy, happy life, because that is my responsibility as a parent and caretaker." But she doesn't. She either takes him to fucking exorcists like it's the 12th goddamn century, or she hides him away and alternatively browbeats and ignores him out of some misguided, "sin-and-damnation" shame.

And that is entirely her fault.

 

[WachtAmWeb]

Good transcript, can't have been easy. Thanks!

This, plus the previous references to meds and his general behaviour pretty much confirms for me that Jace has schizophrenia.

The "pre-historian Victorian" and "white shaved head/Walter White" parts demonstrate the clanging and loose association that are common symptoms of schizophrenia.

Those links are a gold-mine - check out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizophasia - it's a perfect description of Jace's completely off-the-wall use of language - for example, "it is two-oh-one-four on this site eastern standard time EST such as the place which is through the will of Jesus Christo Rendator for your intel and that's what I believe such and/or as".

 

[Flowers For Sonichu]

Ha, I did policy debate in college. One of the weird things about it is that you have to speak as quickly as possible while being comprehensible in your speeches so you can make as many arguments as possible in the allotted time. Jace was going about the speed you need to go in a rebuttal speech.

Also, this totally destroys the ruseman theory. You can't fake this sort of crazy.

I'm just not feeling the vibe that she's a Borb in this situation per se.

She's worse than Barb, she's on a Nick Bate's Mom level in parenting where she probably thinks she and Pastor Faggot can pray away Jace's craziness

 

[Zim]

It's stupid to blame him mom for this. We don't know the facts of the situation. Jace clearly has issues. Newsflash: some people are just messed up. How do you think his mom feels having a crazy son? People keep saying "religious" mom as if her not being religious would help Jace.

There is no one but Jace to blame for his insanity, and if that is a result of natural mental illness, then blame nature.

Obviously we all hope things work out for everyone and that Jace keeps it together and ends up having a happy, normal life, but I always read on here people putting blame onto his mom, which I think is just wrong.

Not that it matters because we're all just spewing crap on an internet forum so whatever.

It's true we don't have all the facts about his mom and I totally agree that it would be extremely hard and depressing to have kid as messed up as Jace. It's also true that it isn't all her fault. I'm saying she's just sort of a shitty person in the way she handles him. She doesn't or can't keep him on his meds and, from what it looks like, uses the church and her religion as a way to try and fix Jace. You can tell just by the way he talks that it's having a bad effect on him. Just look at how he went to jesus camp. She sent him there to try and cure him and all that happened was he came back claiming it was marine boot camp.

I feel bad that she had a kid as messed up in the head as Jace. I can't imagine how hard it would be and the level of patience required to put up with him 24/7 however mostly using religion as a cure all is terrible.

 

[Gorogoroth]

I think Gail's biggest problem is she's just really thick. Religion doesn't necessarily mean people are ignorant. At least the main stream churches seem to value education more than evangelicals, or so it seems to me. TBH I don't know how they balance logic and religion but whatever.
I think if Gail didn't have religion, she'd have some other pseudo science cure to fall back on, like reiki or healing crystals or something,

 

[MrsFrizzle]

Actually, if it's naturally occurring then we probably CAN blame his mom, since there's a 50% chance (or higher, if the gene is linked to the X chromosome) it's her fault. Like his baldness, which is 100% Gail's fault unless Jace has been taking roids.

Schizophrenia is estimated to be 24 to 40% heritable. It seems to be equally heritable along maternal and paternal lines. Which does open the question: maybe that's why Jace's dad is out of the picture?

Gail is still being a crap parent for not getting Jace more help. They are right near a med school (UMass Worcester) with an outstanding psych faculty that offers clinics, etc.

 

[Shadow Fox]

Good god, that call. It's like the Micro Machines guy having a psychotic break.

Considering that Gail thinks that Bible study, a stint at a "Jesus camp" with no psychological credentials, and a fucking exorcism are going to cure the "demons" of paranoid schizophrenia, and also considering that she continues to isolate Jace and mismanage his condition, it's a lot more than "some people are just messed up."

Exactly. Gail's shenanigans are just a couple of steps removed from those fuckwits who let their kids die of treatable diseases because their religion forbids medical treatment.

 

[Himawari]

TBH I don't know how they balance logic and religion but whatever.

"God created everything. Ergo, He also created science and logic for us to utilize."

That's literally all there is to it.

I tried writing some commentary on the call here so that this post would be more on-topic but I think you guys have all covered it already. That was insane.

 

[The Dude]

@Null You've got my sympathies. Having been on the phone with Jace a few times myself I know how difficult it can be.

 

[BillRiley]

Spoiler

Sorry in advance, but I couldn't disagree more.

Considering that Gail thinks that Bible study, a stint at a "Jesus camp" with no psychological credentials, and a fucking exorcism are going to cure the "demons" of paranoid schizophrenia, and also considering that she continues to isolate Jace and mismanage his condition, it's a lot more than "some people are just messed up."

Religiosity, extreme or otherwise, can lead to irrational and even harmful behavior, especially when the religiosity of a parent is imposed on a sick, disabled, or otherwise impaired child. In this case, Gail not being religious would give her no reason to keep Jace away from qualified doctors and case workers in favor of untrained pastors and camp counselors, but her being religious gives her plenty of reasons. Horrible, shitty reasons, but the possibility of being wrong doesn't even occur to the true believer, because their religion and their methods are always, always right.

It's true that "some people are just messed up," since biology plays a big part in mental illness, but coping skills for mental illness don't grow up in a vacuum. Do you think that Chris would have turned out to be the shitstorm he is today if his autism had been properly recognized and treated by supporting parents? Of course not. I'm not saying that Jace isn't responsible for his current actions, because he is, but Gail is likewise responsible for hers. You can't whitewash the harm done to him over the years by Gail, and you can't deny that her religiosity increased said harm many times over.

As for how Gail "feels" about having "a crazy son," that's irrelevant. She is the parent and Jace is the child, and considering his condition, she is still his legal guardian. If she was a decent mother with an ounce of actual love, then she should feel something like "My poor child, you have a legitimate medical condition. That is nothing to be ashamed of. I will do everything I can to educate myself on the realities of your illness, take the advice of trained professionals, and do whatever I can to get you the help that you need to live real healthy, happy life, because that is my responsibility as a parent and caretaker." But she doesn't. She either takes him to fucking exorcists like it's the 12th goddamn century, or she hides him away and alternatively browbeats and ignores him out of some misguided, "sin-and-damnation" shame.

And that is entirely her fault.

I wish there was a better rating I could give the above than just 'Winner'. The two major things Chris-Tran and Commander Jace share in spades are mental illness and epically shitty parenting. Gail finds her religion so comforting that she'd rather stay in her jesus-flavored hugbox than go outside of it to find her son real effective medical help, and that's a pretty pathetic failure of nerve right there.

 

[Da Big Staw]

It's amazing how Jace and his friends have deteriorated since the internet caught wind of them. I am far more concerned for Jaces mental health, and safety then i ever have been with Chris.

When people said "Oh hes gonna turn into another gail" I did not want to believe. Yet at least Gail seems "grounded" in her fantasy unlike Jace.

 

[CWCissey]

Yet at least Gail seems "grounded" in her fantasy unlike Jace.

This is because Pastor Faggot keeps her satisfied in her fantasies.

If you know what I mean...

 

[A-№1]

Religiosity, extreme or otherwise, can lead to irrational and even harmful behavior, especially when the religiosity of a parent is imposed on a sick, disabled, or otherwise impaired child. In this case, Gail not being religious would give her no reason to keep Jace away from qualified doctors and case workers in favor of untrained pastors and camp counselors, but her being religious gives her plenty of reasons. Horrible, shitty reasons, but the possibility of being wrong doesn't even occur to the true believer, because their religion and their methods are always, always right.

[…]

And that is entirely her fault.

I completely agree with everything you've said, but with one caveat: I'm not entirely convinced Gail is any more responsible for her insane choices than Jace is his.

Insanity runs in families, and it seems quite possible to me that Gail is just as nutty as Jace is. Where Jace frames his disconnection from reality in terms of video games and a childish concept of the military, Gail could very well express her insanity through her religious behavior. She wouldn't be the first in that. Gail may only be able to appear to cope better than Jace because insanity expressed through religion is more easily masked and more accepted by society at large than insanity expressed through a video game world view.

From what I've seen, nobody, and I mean nobody, in the Jace Connors Experience is running at full steam. Everyone immediately around him seems to be either profoundly stupid or sociopathic or narcissistic or immature or delusional or whatever. Including the parents. I really do sometimes wonder if there really is something in the water there. The only person around Jace who might possibly be 100% hunky-dory is his brother, and his options might well be limited in the face of Gail's religion.

So I'm not going to outright condemn Gail with the limited information we have on her (especially considering our source) until we somehow do get proof that she is actually responsible for her actions. Presumption of innocence and all that. Pastor Faggot, on the other hand, is an entirely different matter. Even if Gail's religious behavior is insanely inspired, a man professing an official position like "pastor" should damn well know better and at least try to get Jace (and possibly Gail) the secular mental health care he needs. Instead of helping the situation he seems to be enabling Gail.

tl;dr: Gail is indeed a horribly incompetent parent, but she might not be able to help that because she might just be as nutty as Jace is.

 

[Truck Rockfort]

Has there been any hint has to what Gail's denomination or church is? Since Jace always refers to Faggot as a Pastor then they're probably protestant unless Jace isn't being stupid about the what a is Pastor, but what I wondering is if they're part of a mainstream branch or some sort of fringe group?

This just might me being ignorant about other denominations (My faith being a Christian/Native beliefs) but Faith healing is something I usually associated with Protestants and Exorcisms was something I thought was mostly Catholic, unless someone can tell me I'm wrong the only thing I can think they might belong to a fringe group.

 

[A-№1]

This is because Pastor Faggot keeps her satisfied in her fantasies.

If you know what I mean...

I'm pretty sure he was talking about the other Gail. The one who wants Brent Spiner to keep her satisfied in her fantasies. When people were first worrying about Jace becoming "another Gail" I don't think we yet knew Jace's mother was also named Gail.

 

[StallChaser]

It's amazing how Jace and his friends have deteriorated since the internet caught wind of them. I am far more concerned for Jaces mental health, and safety then i ever have been with Chris.

When people said "Oh hes gonna turn into another gail" I did not want to believe. Yet at least Gail seems "grounded" in her fantasy unlike Jace.

The difference between the two is that Chris is being forced to confront reality. Jace is becoming more and more detached from reality. With that detachment comes a detachment from the consequences of his own actions.

 

[Magnesium Fluoride]

I edited part of the call and I'm uploading it here.

Enjoy.
EDIT: 83 video/audio layers were used in the making of this video