Russell Greer vs. Viatron Corporation, A-26-937678-C

[HackerX]

Ah, there is an incorrect assumption here about how the IRS works. Remember the Government Beauracracy is not a business. My mother worked as an IRS Tax Examiner for 25 years. Specifically looking at Business and Corporate filings. Note Tax Examiner not auditor. She would review business filings looking for errors. Finding and correcting errors is the metric on which they were judged and awards were given out. It did not matter if the error was in the governments favor or the businesses. They could care less. They are government employees. The actual outcome is utterly meaningless to them. Only that the forms are filled correctly. There was an episode of Futurama that nailed it perfectly. "How Hermes got his Groove Back" or something like that?

This probably sums up bureaucracy about as well as one possibly could. For better or worse, the role of the individual is to ignore the forest for the trees. It's essentially a system built on isolated, segmented checkmarks that achieve some greater goal in theory.

From personal and professional experience, dealing with governmental employees is a coin toss. One can get a governmental employee who is genuinely friendly and helpful for one encounter and get another who is just as useless and impersonal the next time.

It really is, and more or less dependent on the workplace itself. For example, I've seen some environments where the government personnel watched YouTube videos 90% of the time, and no one was really upset because they were there to basically communicate shit the contractors were doing.

Where you really start to run into issues when it comes to government employees is when they start buying into the idea that being a government employee puts them into a higher echelon than contractors (when working with) or customers. You can kinda keep a lid on that behavior as a contractor, if you take my patented approach, by frequently calling them retards or gooners. Though, I'll admit that's also effectively a ticking time bomb of HR lulz.

You're supposed to set it aside and pay up when it's tax season.

Haha, what a nerd. Imagine paying taxes.
> Me when I don't have to imagine.

 

[reptile baht spaniard rid]

The Government would never in a million years voluntarily admit you overpaid even a penny in taxes.

As others have said, the government might not want to give up something, but the IRS just wants to anally follow the laws, the rules, and the decisions. This results in things that normies don't expect.

Only that the forms are filled correctly.

And anally correct, too, they will spend $10+ dollars to send you lots of paperwork informing you that some number somewhere was wrong, and then say "this doesn't change shit".

I've gotten a letter from the IRS with a check for a small-ish overpayment on regular income taxes over a credit they decided I was eligible for that I didn’t think I was. There are some upstanding people in there.

The IRS sent my dad something like almost $20k because he fucked up and forgot he'd paid estimated tax that year on contracting income, and filled out as if he instead were taking the "eh, didn't have to because" excuse. They were pretty damn fast about it, and even though it was his error, they paid interest on it, too.

The fun part comes where you interpret the law differently then they do, and you go to tax court (or real court if you wanna) and win and then they autistically start fixing everyone else's return to match the new ruling.

 

[Bill Evans 45]

 

[AnOminous]

This probably sums up bureaucracy about as well as one possibly could. For better or worse, the role of the individual is to ignore the forest for the trees. It's essentially a system built on isolated, segmented checkmarks that achieve some greater goal in theory.

Personally I know someone who got audited and they actually found out he'd overpaid and gave him a check for thousands. The IRS are monsters and gravely feared, but they actually do generally adhere to their own rules. I say this as someone currently getting fucked up the ass by them.

Incidentally, I got a decent sized check from them a couple days ago for shit unrelated to why I am in hock to them and basically their cockslave. Wtf?

And anally correct, too, they will spend $10+ dollars to send you lots of paperwork informing you that some number somewhere was wrong, and then say "this doesn't change shit".

The IRS first applies a written test when you file. Then if they have questions, there's an oral examination.

But then comes the anal. . .

 

[not william stenchever]

The IRS first applies a written test when you file. Then if they have questions, there's an oral examination.

But then comes the anal. . .

Written could be archaically reconstrued as manual.

 

[Kiwi Lime Pie]

No they don't and they don't have to. You work for them as an independent contractor under a 1099 which requires no withholding tax

The various gig companies have to file paperwork with the IRS documenting how much he was paid, so it has all the ammo it needs to catch him if he tries to cheat. Whether it will bother is another matter entirely, who gets audited seems completely random.

Generally speaking, contractors paid on a 1099-series form don't have taxes withheld from their earnings. The only exception I can think of is anyone unlucky enough to be subject to 24% backup withholding.

1099-series forms get filed with both the contractor and the IRS (and sometimes the state if they require a copy). So, someone filing a tax return needs to declare that income because the IRS already knows it exists. If a return is filed without that income, the taxpayer can expect at the very least a CP-series notice whose TL; DR is "You didn't declare all your income - here is what you forgot, and here is how much more in tax, interest, and penalties you owe." An examination might be more likely the greater the percentage of unreported income is in reference to the total income for the year.

so does this mean independent contractors don't have to pay income tax at all or is he supposed to set aside that money for when it's tax season?

Quarterly, actually.

One should expect to save at least 25% of net self-employment income to cover Federal taxes plus whatever other percentage is needed for state and local ones. A tax pro can help with the projections if needed.

Federal estimates are required if the tax balance exceeds $1000. States and cities vary, but many have a $500 threshold. This is one area where having a knowledgeable tax pro can help.

They were pretty damn fast about it, and even though it was his error, they paid interest on it, too.

If I recall, the government has to include interest on a refund if they've held on to the amount for more than 45 days after the return was filed and received.

 

[The Garden]

UM posted this over in the GvM thread: https://kiwifarms.st/threads/greer-v-moon-no-20-cv-00647-d-utah-sep-16-2020.174285/post-24759320

Reading the filing, it mentioned an EEOC right-to-sue letter. Could the fact the Russ has not produced such a letter be proof that he was lying about having a EEOC case for his "discrimination"? Not that I'm saying a known liar who lies would tell lies to the court or anything...

 

[Harvey Danger]

Reading the filing, it mentioned an EEOC right-to-sue letter. Could the fact the Russ has not produced such a letter be proof that he was lying about having a EEOC case for his "discrimination"? Not that I'm saying a known liar who lies would tell lies to the court or anything...

I think the process is file an EEOC complaint, the EEOC looks at it, does some bureaucratic magic, and at the end you get a right-to-sue letter if they think you have a good claim. Greer insists that the EEOC "accepted" his claim, likely only meaning he filed it. But I don't think we've seen any EEOC updates from the process; they could still be looking at it, they could've dismissed it, they could ask for more information, or they could be contacting the employer directly to ask questions or even mediate.

But now that this case is officially in arbitration, I don't know that the EEOC can really do anything. You can't break binding arbitration to do mediation (I think), and ViaTron/Hardin would be stupid to agree to it. Even if the EEOC decides "yep the retard has a case" and give Greer a letter, all that does it let him sue in federal court. I don't think he can do so, now that arbitration is covering all claims from the beginning of time.

 

[Prokhor Zakharov]

I think the process is file an EEOC complaint, the EEOC looks at it, does some bureaucratic magic, and at the end you get a right-to-sue letter if they think you have a good claim. Greer insists that the EEOC "accepted" his claim, likely only meaning he filed it. But I don't think we've seen any EEOC updates from the process; they could still be looking at it, they could've dismissed it, they could ask for more information, or they could be contacting the employer directly to ask questions or even mediate.

But now that this case is officially in arbitration, I don't know that the EEOC can really do anything. You can't break binding arbitration to do mediation (I think), and ViaTron/Hardin would be stupid to agree to it. Even if the EEOC decides "yep the retard has a case" and give Greer a letter, all that does it let him sue in federal court. I don't think he can do so, now that arbitration is covering all claims from the beginning of time.

One of the stipulations to arbitration was the dismissal of OSHA and EEOC claims, wasn't it?

 

[Harvey Danger]

One of the stipulations to arbitration was the dismissal of OSHA and EEOC claims, wasn't it?

Kind of.

(full doc)

"all claims... that were raised, or could have been raised" very likely covers everything OSHA or EEOC could look at. Greer apparently listed every single plight in this suit, and said he already filed the same issues with those agencies. At the time others pointed out he's not supposed to double-dip like that, but he did because he's desperate for that $20k.

If he filed some new issue with OSHA/EEOC that isn't mentioned in this suit, he could try pursuing that separately or in federal court if he gets the right-to-sue letter. He'd argue the federal issue is different from the state issue, or some equally stupid argument. But I'm 99% sure that would get slapped down as a "could have been raised" claim here.

 

[Prokhor Zakharov]

Kind of.

(full doc)

"all claims... that were raised, or could have been raised" very likely covers everything OSHA or EEOC could look at. Greer apparently listed every single plight in this suit, and said he already filed the same issues with those agencies. At the time others pointed out he's not supposed to double-dip like that, but he did because he's desperate for that $20k.

If he filed some new issue with OSHA/EEOC that isn't mentioned in this suit, he could try pursuing that separately or in federal court if he gets the right-to-sue letter. He'd argue the federal issue is different from the state issue, or some equally stupid argument. But I'm 99% sure that would get slapped down as a "could have been raised" claim here.

I was thinking of section 5 of the same document:



It was smart of them to include this clause foreclosing other parallel litigation as much as possible during arbitration.

 

[Useful_Mistake]

and at the end you get a right-to-sue letter if they think you have a good claim.

No. If they think you have a good claim, they sue on your behalf. The "right to sue" letter is for when they don't believe in the value of your claim

But I don't think we've seen any EEOC updates from the process; they could still be looking at it, they could've dismissed it, they could ask for more information, or they could be contacting the employer directly to ask questions or even mediate.

If there's been more than 180 days, they have to give you a right to sue letter if you ask.

 

[Harvey Danger]

No. If they think you have a good claim, they sue on your behalf. The "right to sue" letter is for when they don't believe in the value of your claim

My mistake. I thought if they investigate and dismiss the claim, they don't issue the letter. It seems weird to do an investigation, and the outcome for "this is garbage" and "this is plausible but we couldn't fully investigate" is the same.

I would think a defendant like ViaTron would be owed a report that said EEOC found no reasonable cause for suit, to defend against exactly this kind of vexatious garbage. But then I could see complainers getting angry at EEOC, and they'd switch to concluding every such investigation with "we take no position" for CYA.

If there's been more than 180 days, they have to give you a right to sue letter if you ask.

That would've been May 3, but since he filed in state court he doesn't get another try in federal court.

But this goes back to my original concern, that if Greer loses completely at arbitration, he's going to try some stupid "ok but my EEOC claims are COMPLETELY SEPARATE" gambit. I found this in the original complaint while looking up the date:



Of course he goes on to whine about discrimination and retaliation anyway. But he will say technically those two issues aren't included in any of his 6 Causes of Action. If he really did limit his EEOC/OSHA filings to those two matters exclusively, he can try weaseling out of the "any claims that could have been raised" language in the arbitration agreement.

 

[Prokhor Zakharov]

My mistake. I thought if they investigate and dismiss the claim, they don't issue the letter. It seems weird to do an investigation, and the outcome for "this is garbage" and "this is plausible but we couldn't fully investigate" is the same.

I would think a defendant like ViaTron would be owed a report that said EEOC found no reasonable cause for suit, to defend against exactly this kind of vexatious garbage. But then I could see complainers getting angry at EEOC, and they'd switch to concluding every such investigation with "we take no position" for CYA.


Wyświetl załącznik 9152409

That would've been May 3, but since he filed in state court he doesn't get another try in federal court.

But this goes back to my original concern, that if Greer loses completely at arbitration, he's going to try some stupid "ok but my EEOC claims are COMPLETELY SEPARATE" gambit. I found this in the original complaint while looking up the date:

Wyświetl załącznik 9152419

Of course he goes on to whine about discrimination and retaliation anyway. But he will say technically those two issues aren't included in any of his 6 Causes of Action. If he really did limit his EEOC/OSHA filings to those two matters exclusively, he can try weaseling out of the "any claims that could have been raised" language in the arbitration agreement.

He could try, but I think section 5 of the stipulation to arbitration forecloses that potential as much as it possibly can.

 

[StinkySnack]

You just know that Russ is bitching the DJF's head off about this case now that they're representing him again in Greer v. Moon.

 

[BoomerPrime]

You just know that Russ is bitching the DJF's head off about this case now that they're representing him again in Greer v. Moon.

Good. Those faggots deserve to suffer through Shitlips' unrelated plightsperging (along with being fired out of a cannon...into the Sun).

 

[Lentil Soup]

If he really did limit his EEOC/OSHA filings to those two matters exclusively, he can try weaseling out of the "any claims that could have been raised" language in the arbitration agreement.

I really love the way he lumps OSHA into his ACA and disability discrimination claims as if it's relevant at all. I had assumed that his passing reference to the DOL early in the complaint was for the ACA claim but I think that even he has confused himself with the omniplight. He's truly just throwing everything at the wall to see what sticks.

(Incidentally, to my knowledge his specific ACA concern seems to be more in IRS's wheelhouse since it was just an administrative error but this could be amusing.)

 

[Prokhor Zakharov]

I really love the way he lumps OSHA into his ACA and disability discrimination claims as if it's relevant at all. I had assumed that his passing reference to the DOL early in the complaint was for the ACA claim but I think that even he has confused himself with the omniplight. He's truly just throwing everything at the wall to see what sticks.

(Incidentally, to my knowledge his specific ACA concern seems to be more in IRS's wheelhouse since it was just an administrative error but this could be amusing.)

He is just spamming hoping someone will listen to his plights. OSHA/EEOC/DOJ/FBI/CIA/FDA/EPA/WWF/UFC/KFC/KMA/STFU/etc...

 

[the khat quaffer]

I really love the way he lumps OSHA into his ACA and disability discrimination claims as if it's relevant at all. I had assumed that his passing reference to the DOL early in the complaint was for the ACA claim but I think that even he has confused himself with the omniplight. He's truly just throwing everything at the wall to see what sticks.

(Incidentally, to my knowledge his specific ACA concern seems to be more in IRS's wheelhouse since it was just an administrative error but this could be amusing.)

Sometimes I think Russ's narcissism and perpetual victimhood is the reason he keeps trauma dumping into his filings. That or he genuinely doesn't know what he's even fighting for beyond "me disabled. me feewings hurt. me want money please mr. judge...oh look, some words I can toss in".
People speculate as to whether he reads his threads here. I posit that if Russ were to read the OP of this thread (or GvM), he'd stop and think, "....uh, is THAT what I was saying?" That is assuming he knows half the words in the OP.

He is just spamming hoping someone will listen to his plights. OSHA/EEOC/DOJ/FBI/CIA/FDA/EPA/WWF/UFC/KFC/KMA/STFU/etc...

NAACP

 

[Thomas Talus]

NAACP

NAMI might be more on point.