Weightlifting for Kiwis - Discussion and support regarding the art of swole

[Big Al's Famous Pork]

Cut back on cardio, increased lifting, added a little more eating.
Hunger issue gone.
Second NY strip can be sammiches or something tomorrow.

 

[Johnny Salami]

Alright so I’ve been cutting out exercise except walking my dog because of some irl bullshit. Any advice on how to get some great workouts in preparation for the marines? Idgaf about the political structure anymore I just need to escape.

As others have said, do lots of pull ups as well as push ups and running. Also work on walking with a long stride as you'll be doing lots of hiking in the second half of the training (and even more in SoI). Do shin training as shin splits are pretty common and I'd say squats will also help (do either somewhat heavy to build up core or fast and high reps for endurance). There's not much you can without the couses besides general strength

 

[Iron Jaguar]

I can't get into proper starting position for deadlifts without back rounding

Trap bar, my nigger.

Also, this:

2. engage the lats. think about trying to hold a pen in the back of your armpit
3. Unless you brace proper your back is gonna round the instant the weight leaves the ground.
5. remove the slack from the bar before pulling it

 

[get-tar manajerk]

Several things I do:
1. warm up with some back extension/hinge type movement. Banded Good-Mornings, back extensions, reverse hypers have served me well. They also have the side effect of warming up most of the prime movers
2. engage the lats. think about trying to hold a pen in the back of your armpit
3. Unless you brace proper your back is gonna round the instant the weight leaves the ground. I use the Pallof press for this
4. Hip mobility might be causing the issue. Try elephant walks, i also use a piriformis stretch, my legs in 4-shaped formation and me trying to push my torso into it. You could also "cope" by using a wider stance, or better yet, sumo deadlifts
5. remove the slack from the bar before pulling it
I know it sounds like a lot, but eventually you'll get used to it. I used to tick off a checklist in my head like some stereotypical scene from a movie where theyre starting up a bunch of tech

Thanks. I'll try all of that. I don't really get the pen in back of armpit thing though. My lats are one of the muscle groups I'm least aware of. Don't know how to flex them etc. just know when they're sore from rows.

I'm pretty annoyed that I can't progress because of bad form. I haven't been this motivated to get fit ever in my life. I'm pretty new to weight lifting though. Longest I've ever done it is was for 4 months but that was years ago and I'm trying to build my strength back now. I've been trying to learn how to properly brace. Breathing into my stomach and sort of pushing out to make my abs hard. There's no slack in the bar when I am in starting position but I just can't get to starting position without seriously rounding my back. I see all sorts of explanations for this but I can't touch my toes and I can't squat below parallel without my lower back rounding either so I was wondering if it's a flexibility thing. Started doing some hamstring stretches at home. Also been doing hip hinges with a broomstick at home to practice how it feels to keep my back straight. And hyper extensions at the gym before I deadlift.

I've been going to the gym for 2 months now after an embarrassing number of years of low activity. Had a friend film me deadlifting 165 the other day and my form is so shit I know I'm gonna fuck my back up if I keep adding on weight.

I recommend deadlifts other than standard barbell. I injured my back one day and it took a couple weeks to recover. Dumbbell, hex bar, different variations such as romanian split dumbbell. There are also other exercises that work your back like pull ups and farmer walks.

I was thinking of switching to doing rack pulls while I work on my flexibility. Figured maybe I can work my way closer and closer to the floor over time if I keep doing hamstring stretches and stuff. I'm not very knowledgeable on fitness at all. I'm trying to keep it simple in terms of how many exercises I do but I do do pull-ups already. Guess I'll try some dumbbell variants.

Trap bar, my nigger.

I don't think the gym I go to has that .

Thanks guys, I appreciate the advice.

 

[CharcoalChkn]

I don't think the gym I go to has that .

Don't be afraid to ask if they could get one, I recently asked my gym if they could purchase one and they did.

 

[Ahriman]

Gettin' real tired of this grifter.

 

[MS Paint Gigachad]

Thanks. I'll try all of that. I don't really get the pen in back of armpit thing though. My lats are one of the muscle groups I'm least aware of. Don't know how to flex them etc. just know when they're sore from rows.

Essentially what I'm trying to do with that particular piece of advice is to ensure the bar doesnt stray from your shins. Ive heard people also cue scapulas down and back/"in your back pocket"

As a bonus, here's an illustration of a drill ive done for this. Basically do a normal deadlift but with the band pulling the bar away from you


EDIT: Bracing
Try the Sandwich Drill. Put your hands around your waist (below ribs, above pelvis, in the soft part) and breathe in trying to push the hands away

EDIT: rounding back
You mention that you cant set up a deadlift or squat below parallel without your back rounding. Could be flexibility, could be that you don't get "neutral back" (was the case for me), could be that your stance isnt wide enough, or in the case of deadlifts that your booty is in the wrong place

https://youtube.com/watch?v=fX4H1ZS_OUQ
Gettin' real tired of this grifter.

We all are, arent we? I'd actually watched it, and it sounds so pathetic - and to top it all off hes still trying to portray himself as the good guy
"my brand wouldve done well even without the liver king persona!!"
"I did it to promote the message!"
Choose 1...

Bonus: "i was feeling horrible and the roids helped me" - so the 9 tenets didnt work?

 

[Ewan McGregor]

From the @Vingle ritual humiliation thread, I am calling your attention into this post:

If you don't mind it, I'd like to ask you about your diet. You said you eat basically eggs and fish, which for bulking is great, because it's protein-based. Do you fry your food? I'd advise you not to do that, because high temperatures damage proteins, so you won't absorb the amounts of protein you need. If possible, I'd cook the eggs and eat the fish raw or just slightly cooked. As I said, baking and frying are not in the realm of possibilities.

You also said that you live in the gym. What's your gym routine? For bulking, you need explosion (high intensity and low duration); otherwise, you'll just damage your muscles, specially if you don't eat much, which I believe is your case, since you only eat eggs and fish. I'd recommend a maximum of 3 hours of gym a day, 6 days a week. You need at least one day off a week to let your body rest and have energy for the rest of the week.

Can we discuss this?

 

[ITK]

From the @Vingle ritual humiliation thread, I am calling your attention into this post:



Can we discuss this?

Just fucking eat meat. It's not that hard. "Erm, cooking fish on high temperatures slightly denatures the protein and decreases bioavailability by 1.3%, if you don't eat fish raw, you are wasting everything and might as well kill yourself." Who cares?

 

[Ahriman]

Leaving aside the "booty" part of the video, I can't help but think that personal trainers must have bamboozled all these gym bunnies into making these meme exercises just to show off their ass at the gym, in different positions, probably just to bump up the male attendance. A genius business strategy, really.

Like we've talked previously with the Dana video, you don't need to fall for meme exercises to target your butt--if that's what you're going after.

On a lighter side of things, Mike O'Tren weighs in on the Liver King drama... never a dull moment in the fitness industry.

 

[MS Paint Gigachad]

Just fucking eat meat. It's not that hard. "Erm, cooking fish on high temperatures slightly denatures the protein and decreases bioavailability by 1.3%, if you don't eat fish raw, you are wasting everything and might as well kill yourself." Who cares?

This, and the recommendations are stupidly narrow.
Banning baking and frying specifically is stupid, and i really dont see how eating boiled/steamed food only is gonna help you stick to a diet
I dont see how bulking and eating little is anything but mutually exclusive

you need explosion (high intensity and low duration); otherwise, you'll just damage your muscles

and as for this im pretty sure its been shown you get the same amount of hyperthropy from 5 reps up to 30 reps as long as its to failure. if anything id recommend the opposite, (reasonably) slowly performed reps in sets of 8-20 with 3 reps in reserve or less

 

[Syntaxion]

From the @Vingle ritual humiliation thread, I am calling your attention into this post:



Can we discuss this?

High temperatures don't matter AFAIK.

What happens is that proteins denature due to heat and get broken down into individual amino acids. But the body can absorb those amino acids just fine. Like, even if starch is broken down into sugar, you're still getting 4 calories per gram.

The way proteins work is through "structures":



When amino acids link, that's the primary structure. When that chain of amino acids starts to form into a shape, that's the secondary structure. When that entire structure forms into a different shape, that's tertiary and finally, how all these shapes are linked to eachother, that's the quaternary structure.

In the end, heat can cause the quaternary, tertiary and secondary structures to break:


But the important structure, the primary one (a.k.a the individual amino acids) are left untouched. It'd require a far higher temperature than cooking to break the bonds between amino acids, because we're talking about a lot of energy that keeps them together.





In the end, your body breaks down proteins into individual amino acids anyway, so cooking barely matters, as long as the amino acids remain untouched


tl;dr keep on cooking

 

[Ewan McGregor]

High temperatures don't matter AFAIK.

What happens is that proteins denature due to heat and get broken down into individual amino acids. But the body can absorb those amino acids just fine. Like, even if starch is broken down into sugar, you're still getting 4 calories per gram.

The way proteins work is through "structures":

Wyświetl załącznik 3990357

When amino acids link, that's the primary structure. When that chain of amino acids starts to form into a shape, that's the secondary structure. When that entire structure forms into a different shape, that's tertiary and finally, how all these shapes are linked to eachother, that's the quaternary structure.

In the end, heat can cause the quaternary, tertiary and secondary structures to break:
Wyświetl załącznik 3990378

But the important structure, the primary one (a.k.a the individual amino acids) are left untouched. It'd require a far higher temperature than cooking to break the bonds between amino acids, because we're talking about a lot of energy that keeps them together.

Wyświetl załącznik 3990384

Wyświetl załącznik 3990387

In the end, your body breaks down proteins into individual amino acids anyway, so cooking barely matters, as long as the amino acids remain untouched
Wyświetl załącznik 3990390

tl;dr keep on cooking

Thanks for the elaborate response and it is interesting of seeing the science of basically common sense.

I find it amazing that the big elephant on the room for the weightlifting/bodybuilding/fitness world continues to be roids. Models are roided, personal trainers are roided, influencers are roided, the faces of this thing are all roided. Marvel actors are roided.

Because no one will admit it, and this is an industry, they have to constantly reinvent the wheel.

Ideally, all you need to do is eat a fuck ton of proteins in a balanced diet and lift weight. And if you really want to look like these people, get roided.


But this doesn't sell books, so that's why, not unlike woke, they have to be on a trotskyist permanent revolution where every month everything you know is wrong.

So humans have been cooking food since the neolithic? wrong

Agriculture? Wrong

Husbandry? Wrong

Compound exercises? Wrong

Buy my new Paleolithic Revival with hilariously complex multi myo reps in super sets through ergonomic biomecanics!


I think all those weird ideas are not unlike all those crazy diets and fads women have been falling and keep falling for since forever and we laugh at them for.

In all seriousness, Men's Health Magazine is the Cosmopolitan for men.

 

[Meriasek]

Did 298 lbs for 5x5 on squats today, my legs feel rather fucked up now. Time switch program. Any recommendations for a somewhat intermediate lifter? I don't necessarily want to go full powerlifting nor full bodybuilding, something more powerbuilding-y would be ideal. I've been looking at Wendler 5/3/1, although Madcow was pretty nice the last time I did that.

 

[Vingle]

From the @Vingle ritual humiliation thread, I am calling your attention into this post:
Can we discuss this?

I said we should keep it in the thread, but nobody wants to comment on my routine.

People overestimate how much protein is needed to build muscles. It's needed, but not the enormous amount that brosciences guys think. But yea, and in frying oil too. Mixing it with
6 eggs
400 gram of pollock
4 onions
4 carrots
4 potatoes
soy sauce
spices.
I eat this up in 2 days, and with 1 whole garlic bread baguette on the side for each time I eat.

And about the fish thing. It's normal fish, not specially treated to be used in sushi. I mean, I eat sushi, but that shit is expensive and I'm not risking getting sick.

I do drink one shake a day too, homemade.
5 cups of Oatmeal (I use a cup I got with a rice cooker)
1 scoops Protein powder
3 tablespoons Peanut butter
1 l milk

Day 1:
Squats. Max 95 kg currently (not doing ass to grass anymore, as that gave me knee pains. So just regular depth)
Leg press Max 220 kg currently
I do 4 repetitions and 2 sets at max, with about 3 min rest time in between. Often longer, because browsing on my phone.

Resting day:
Did run on the treadmill, but foot is hurting. So thinking of not trying again until sometime in January.

Day 3:
Deadlift Max 60 kg. Could probably take more, but I hurt my back before with it. So more wary of going all-out on deadlift.

Chest press Max 50 kg, did stay put on 40 kg for a long time. So it's better at least.
Chest press on machine 90 kg
Pull ups, normal grip and take about 10 reps
Same reps/sets/resting time as day 1

I do both barbell and machine, as they complement each other. You work out more balance and small support muscles with barbell. Meanwhile you can push yourself to the max without hurting yourself at the machines. Which again will make it easier to do the barbell lifts, as you’re mostly working out the support muscles.

I'm aware you need high weigh and low reps, otherwise you're just working on conditioning. Or how long you last (Unsure of the term)

That's the point of getting bigger muscles. You tear apart the muscle fibres and they heal into becoming bigger (more resistant)

I did mention that I did weight 68 kg when I decided to bulk. Now I'm at 80 kg, I know I did say 78 kg last time I did mention it. But it keeps increasing, which is good obviously.
Gaining some fat and a gut is common in bulking, and being afraid of that is number 1 reason for why you will never get bigger musclewise.

3-4 hours is max anyway. I'm faster done on day 1 though

Well, obviously. You have given a few of the worst fucking advices I've ever seen. I get that you want to help, but I can't help but laugh. But the fucking fish, are you fucking trying to kill me?

And lol, PT's are a scam until you are so advanced that you need some guidance to get even further. I only see fat fucks and middle aged to old people that are too lazy to work out on their own. Actually use PT's

Edit: Forgot my supplements.
ZMA
Omega 3
Green tea concentrate
Vit D + K
Creatine
Ashwagandha

Probably getting something in my PWO too. But nearly everything is watered down versions from what muricans have, as Norway is a cucked country.

 

[CharcoalChkn]

And lol, PT's are a scam until you are so advanced that you need some guidance to get even further. I only see fat fucks and middle aged to old people that are too lazy to work out on their own. Actually use PT's

This is simply not true, PTs are very helpful for beginners and intermediates to make sure their form is correct/coach them out of any bad habits they may have picked up and not noticed.

I grab a PT for a session every few months to check my form is still in a good way. Sometimes even to ask them advice on a routine and compare it with my own, there's no one way to work out and I love getting advice from other people, trying it, seeing how it works out and adjusting my routine if I like it.

 

[Iron Jaguar]

This is simply not true, PTs are very helpful for beginners and intermediates to make sure their form is correct/coach them out of any bad habits they may have picked up and not noticed.

I agree with this. I don't use a PT myself but I am an experienced, intermediate level lifter. Frankly, I am much stronger than most PT's.

My advice to anyone thinking about getting into lifting is this: "Find a trainer who has the physique you want."

 

[Vingle]

My advice to anyone thinking about getting into lifting is this: "Find a trainer who has the physique you want."

This, and I haven't seen one yet.

You can use a PT for technique if you want @CharcoalChkn. But PT's aren't superhumans and you can easily learn techniques by yourself. Sure, get one session to make sure you’re not going full retard, but wasting money on PT's more than necessarily is retarded.
It's your money and you can do whatever you want, it's not my problem.

 

[CharcoalChkn]

This, and I haven't seen one yet.

You can use a PT for technique if you want @CharcoalChkn. But PT's aren't superhumans and you can easily learn techniques by yourself. Sure, get one session to make sure you’re not going full retard, but wasting money on PT's more than necessarily is retarded.
It's your money and you can do whatever you want, it's not my problem.

I'm obviously not going to change your mind, but not everyone is a perfect human specimen such as yourself and needs a little help to get their feet off the ground correctly.

I am genuinely coming from a place of wanting to help you/not see you injure yourself. You spoke about having injuries and soreness while training (namely deadlifts which is not an exercise you want to fuck around and find out with), I do think it is at least something worth looking into or even speaking to a physio so you don't hurt yourself further.

Call me retarded.

 

[Ahriman]

Who was in the wrong here?