The Misunderstood Defense Budget - I'm going deep

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Space_Dandy

kiwifarms.net
Dołączono
9 Paź 2014
The United States' defense budget has long been the subject of tremendous concern and controversy, both within the country and among international observers. It has been pointed out that the US military receives funding that is not only the first in the world, but that eclipses the combined total of the next 9 or so nations, most of those being allies. How is this defensible? Clearly there is excessive government spending benefiting weapons tech companies, right? And yet, there is a strong case to be made that the defense budget is not nearly as bloated as is often portrayed.

I'll briefly touch on the central topics of many common explanations for justifying the US' military budget before explaining the elephant in the room that goes unmentioned by critics and apologists alike. The first thing that defenders of the defense budget are quick to point out is the incredible cost of paying, training, housing, equipping, etc an armed force in the US compared to many of these other countries that can be compared with. And this is true, for reasons outside the scope of this writing, it often costs the US government multiple times as much to accomplish something when domestic labor is a factor that perhaps another nation would afford much more efficiently. Paying military salaries, benefits, and support infrastructure is indeed a large share of the total 'military budget' that often goes unconsidered by the armchair critic. That is, VA hospitals and retirement plans, benefits for the wounded, for dependents, these obligations and many others were promised long ago and aren't going away if Congress limits the DoD's budget. The majority of the DoD's budget isn't going towards the big scary military industrial complex.

Under President Obama, slashes were made to the defense budget (while he was in the middle of escalating conflicts in Syria, Libya, Yemen, Iraq, and Afghanistan..) and the DoD reeled and convulsed in agony. You can read about the 2013 US budget sequestration to get the whole picture if you aren't familiar. Some highlights include jobs slashed, recruitment halted, civilian workers given mandatory unpaid time off (furlough), promotions and hiring were frozen for years, transfers and long-term orders were scrutinized heavily. The bulk of Obama's cuts came out of labor costs ultimately. But the scope of the mission didn't change. Do more with less. The repercussions of this decision now 10 years ago are still being felt today, as annual budgets and manning for government institutions are based on the year prior. There are some positions that have been critically undermanned ever since, quite literally doing the job of multiple people, which results in single-points of failure and bureaucratic nightmares in getting anything accomplished.

So does this mean the defense budget can't or shouldn't be reduced?

There are roughly 750 US military bases across 80 nations. That, more than the dollar figure of the defense budget, is the category in which the US military truly dwarfs the rest of the world. This is not normal. Us Americans never experience having a foreign military permanently stationed on our soil, much less in numbers that dwarf our own domestic forces. But that is a common experience around the world, with US troops almost exclusively. Part of the reason why this is tolerated is the US pays these countries an incredible sum of money for allowing the use of their land. The truth is that this is the reason so many other of the US allies have tiny militaries. Why have your own army when the most powerful one in the world will pay YOU to offer their protection? Most nations produce a military of some kind, but some nations rely 100% on UN/US protection lacking even the most superficial armed forces.

The defense budget cannot be meaningfully or responsibly cut without closing bases down. And that is a matter of foreign policy, where the real problem lies. The US is paying for the privilege of being the world's police. To be in everyone's backyard, watching, waiting. We've been playing 4D chess for a long time now, wagering untold trillions in order to gain influence. To be the central figure in the UN. To have no larger authority to answer to for our own transgressions. Who is our opponent in this century long chess game? Whatever the motivations of our leaders truly are, its clear the game isn't ending any time soon.

Comparing any nation's 'defense budget' whose purpose is the protection of its territory, to the US's global occupation force, as if the later is merely too bloated is to entirely miss the point.
 
Ostatnio edytowane:
At this point, the US military is just a social welfare program. You could reduce the size by 80% and still have total superiority, so the extra budget is wasted. At least they lowered the standards now so the fat useless kids of today can make it in.
 
Use-it-or-lose-it budgeting is probably the biggest concern. You wouldn't believe how the military spends money, and on what particular things, if they're afraid they aren't going to get the same amount later. In that sense, most bases set their own budgets. I've seen fleets of golf carts, video games, bar renovations, drag cars, and the professional ceiling suspension of fuselages of retired aircraft being used as recreational flight sim equipment, just because they want to steal my tax money in the same amount as last time.
 
Good point about the overseas bases, many people forget that.

The US Defense Budget is one of those issues that you have loads of smug eurofaggots and retarded amerimutts mouthing off complete meme slogans that have been repeated for decades without either of them understanding how deep the issue is. This extremely inflated budget comes from dozens of factors playing and interacting with each other in ways that you cannot just solve with a simply slashing of the budget at the source.

Like OP mentioned, Obama tried to do some cutting and it barely worked. The overall cost did not go down much in absolute terms and yet it disproportional affected the people who are employed. A lot of the budget goes towards paying for a endless amount of hardware that tends to go to waste or is barely used, with the anecdotal examples of 100 dollar toilet seats and 12 dollar screws being a classic example of how the MIC makes money off it and the actual hardware soldiers are expected to use not really being worth the money they ask for such as the Bradley IFV, F-22 program and the 3 tries to replace the M4 that all ended up in "nah we will just keep using the M4 anyway thanks guys".

You cannot just reduce the budget because that would mean giving up superpower status. And you cannot support the budget as it is because it is draining the coffers and the ability of the USA to keep itself working.

Damn if you do, damned if you don't.
 
Think about the cost of all the training, travel expenses due to deployments, and gear/equipment for one single US Marine.

Then consider the infinitely cheaper cost of a roadside IED planted by an Afghan insurgent with infinitely cheaper gear and an infinitely cheaper (and much more effective and reliable than the M4) AKM.

I get the old saying "you get what you pay for" but the US Military has a historical track record of failure after failure anytime they fight a genuine asymmetrical insurgent force like the Taliban, Viet Cong, any of the different insurgent groups that operated in Iraq's "Sunni Triangle", Somalis during Black Hawk Down, etc. The only time I think the US ever decisively defeated a hostile insurgent group was the short-lived Werwolf insurgency during WW2- put that was due in part to the fact that Hitler despised the idea of a Nazi insurgency and refused to ever support the notion.
 
Think about the cost of all the training, travel expenses due to deployments, and gear/equipment for one single US Marine.

Then consider the infinitely cheaper cost of a roadside IED planted by an Afghan insurgent with infinitely cheaper gear and an infinitely cheaper (and much more effective and reliable than the M4) AKM.

I get the old saying "you get what you pay for" but the US Military has a historical track record of failure after failure anytime they fight a genuine asymmetrical insurgent force like the Taliban, Viet Cong, any of the different insurgent groups that operated in Iraq's "Sunni Triangle", Somalis during Black Hawk Down, etc. The only time I think the US ever decisively defeated a hostile insurgent group was the short-lived Werwolf insurgency during WW2- put that was due in part to the fact that Hitler despised the idea of a Nazi insurgency and refused to ever support the notion.
To be fair there hasn't been many examples of an occupying force winning out against an insurgency let alone one getting foreign aid.
 
>have two giant oceans insulating you from invasion
>fund bases all over the globe to protect yourself from threats on the literal opposite side of the planet
>have a 2000 mile border with a country more violent than Iraq during the surge
>do nothing

:story:
The real problem, in my opinion and experience, are contractors and the whole system of procurement. Most of the defense budget is funneled into shit like NAVFAC and paying ridiculous amounts for tools, parts, and materials in a massive waste of money.
There are lots of big deal weapons contracts that go nowhere, or lead to dud weapon systems.

Here are a couple of my favorites;
 
doesnt a single screw basically cost the army like 100 bucks or some shit? like i can go to home depot and get like 10 pounds of screws for half that if not less
The whole thing about the screws is tolerances. The automotive industry and commercial aviation has a similar problem.
As with any manufactured component: no two are exactly alike. If I tell you "cut this rod to 5 inches" and payed you a dollar to do it, I expect you to slap it against a ruler and draw a pencil mark before cutting it. If I tell you "cut this rod to 5 inches" and payed you $100, you'd better get the micrometer out.

These screws are cut to precise dimensions, the pitch on the threads are measured, the material is tested for defects, etc. Is this cost justified?
Well, if you're building a shelf, one bad screw is no big deal. It does the job all the same. If you're flying at supersonic speeds at 30 thousand feet, one slightly bad screw can mean a really bad day.
 
The whole thing about the screws is tolerances. The automotive industry and commercial aviation has a similar problem.
As with any manufactured component: no two are exactly alike. If I tell you "cut this rod to 5 inches" and payed you a dollar to do it, I expect you to slap it against a ruler and draw a pencil mark before cutting it. If I tell you "cut this rod to 5 inches" and payed you $100, you'd better get the micrometer out.

These screws are cut to precise dimensions, the pitch on the threads are measured, the material is tested for defects, etc. Is this cost justified?
Well, if you're building a shelf, one bad screw is no big deal. It does the job all the same. If you're flying at supersonic speeds at 30 thousand feet, one slightly bad screw can mean a really bad day.
bruh theyre the exact same screws i can pick up at home depot for 10 bucks in a pack of 100 or so
 
bruh theyre the exact same screws i can pick up at home depot for 10 bucks in a pack of 100 or so
I don't know if you're shitposting, but unironically take some time to look at two random screws out of the same pack. Be real autistic about it. You'll more than likely be able to spot slight differences between the two. One might be a tad pointier. The other might be a little sharper around the edges. You'll invariably see little manufacturing marks in random places. All little "lol, who cares? It's a fucking 10 cent screw" shit.
As you go up in price, you tend to see less of that shit.
 
Didn't you guys spend a trillion dollar on some meme jet that was completely unnecessary because you already had the best jets in the world by a mile?
I get that the US military budget is greatly overstated (as a percentage of the GDP its kinda normal but the US just has an obscenely huge GDP), but all this empire building and propping up largely unprofitable industries that only make money themselves via the govt contracts they get just seems harmful to society... and yeah, all money that can be better spent elsewhere should be.

Think about the cost of all the training, travel expenses due to deployments, and gear/equipment for one single US Marine.

Then consider the infinitely cheaper cost of a roadside IED planted by an Afghan insurgent with infinitely cheaper gear and an infinitely cheaper (and much more effective and reliable than the M4) AKM.

I get the old saying "you get what you pay for" but the US Military has a historical track record of failure after failure anytime they fight a genuine asymmetrical insurgent force like the Taliban, Viet Cong, any of the different insurgent groups that operated in Iraq's "Sunni Triangle", Somalis during Black Hawk Down, etc. The only time I think the US ever decisively defeated a hostile insurgent group was the short-lived Werwolf insurgency during WW2- put that was due in part to the fact that Hitler despised the idea of a Nazi insurgency and refused to ever support the notion.

It did not happen in Japan or Germany because these cultures and the ideologies of the people under these regimes was to blindly obey their states. The state said stop fighting so they did, simple as.
Pretty much all of those Japanese soldiers fighting into the 1970s stopped when ordered to by a superior officer.
 
Use-it-or-lose-it budgeting is probably the biggest concern. You wouldn't believe how the military spends money, and on what particular things, if they're afraid they aren't going to get the same amount later. In that sense, most bases set their own budgets. I've seen fleets of golf carts, video games, bar renovations, drag cars, and the professional ceiling suspension of fuselages of retired aircraft being used as recreational flight sim equipment, just because they want to steal my tax money in the same amount as last time.
It's Israeli army, but I heard a funny story about a department with this kind of budgeting not allowing any expense for nearly the entire year only for the last month which had ridiculous pointless spending to finish the budget so they can ask for more budget.
 
Wasn't the whole point of Trump banging on about big NATO allies (like Germany) not pulling their weight with defence spending percent based on this exact problem?
He didn't seem to realize that "self-sufficient German military" directly translates to "majority-muslim military in charge of the EU" in one generation. This is true for all of Europe. If you don't want to put nuclear weapons directly into the hands of camel-fuckers who would doom the entire human race out of paranoia or because (insert desolate sand hovel here) does not belong to (insert gay desert book here) then you must have the U.S. be their military & that dictates spending.
 
He didn't seem to realize that "self-sufficient German military" directly translates to "majority-muslim military in charge of the EU" in one generation. This is true for all of Europe. If you don't want to put nuclear weapons directly into the hands of camel-fuckers who would doom the entire human race out of paranoia or because (insert desolate sand hovel here) does not belong to (insert gay desert book here) then you must have the U.S. be their military & that dictates spending.
To be fair on Trump this was before Merkel forced the EU to commit demographic suicide by opening the gates to migrants.
 
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