If Marx came back today, which of his beliefs would change?

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bulletttproof

kiwifarms.net
Dołączono
10 Maj 2026
If Marx came back today, he'd see:
  • Every socialist state having been brutally authoritarian
  • With the exception of North Korea and Cuba, all socialist states collapsing or transitioning to state capitalism
  • Many of his predictions being incorrect, notably the late stage collapse
But, there were many things he was right about. With over a hundred years of data, what of his ideology would change?
 
Marx was a manchild with arrested development who spent his whole life offloading his personal accountability onto faceless societal structures.

Why would he ever admit to being wrong about anything?
Having read Kapital, it should have been obvious that Marx was just a bitter proto-alog and shitposter.

Communism is was nothing more than an elaborate way to dunk on David Ricardo for not being sufficiently retarded.

Thoughts @XL xQgg?QcQCaTYDMjqoDnYpG ?
 
In asking this question, you're quietly assuming that Marx thought about society the way a scientist approaches reality. Deriving conclusions from evidence, revising a thesis when the evidence changes, basic stuff.
This is clearly not how Marx reasoned. Much of his framework is directly downstream of his hostility toward private property, capital accumulation, class hierarchy, and bourgeois society. His economic and historical "theories" are built around those commitments, they're not conclusions that were reluctantly reached from observation.
This is important because that attitude has a direct effect on how a person interprets failed predictions. If someone's thinking is fundamentally reality-constrained, then repeated predictive failure puts the framework itself under pressure. Marx and Marxists, however, have tended to absorb contrary outcomes through reinterpretation instead.
In simple terms, say it with me: "that was not real socialism".
Or foreign sabotage, premature conditions, capitalist interference, revisionism, false consciousness, etc.pp.

Essentially, I doubt Marx would change much about his core antagonism toward capitalism. Marx's opinions did not come from assessing evidence, so new evidence won't change Marx's opinions.
 
Both lol. It might be more accurate to say Ricardo and Marx. Could Communism have existed if it wasn't for Ricardo?
I'd say there's a kernel of truth in what you said. Marx inherited and modified a classical economics framework associated with Adam Smith and especially David Ricardo, particularly regarding the labor theory of value. Ricardo's version did heavily tie the exchange value of goods to embodied labor, and Marx developed that into socially necessary labor time, surplus value, exploitation, and eventually, a broader indictment of "capitalism" itself.
In a way, it's a cautionary tale. Don't publish bad theory, because some dipshit can come along, inherit it, push it further than you intended or foresaw, and then treat the resulting nonsense as a revelation about reality rather than as defects in your premises.

Regarding the other question, I'd say it could absolutely exist without Ricardo because Marx also drew from (terrible) German philosophy, French socialism, Hegelian dialectics, Ludwig Feuerbach, class politics, revolutionary movements, and earlier socialist thought. But it's safe to say that the specific economic architecture would have been very different without Ricardo.
Ricardo gave Marx much of the economic scaffolding with labor-value reasoning, distribution conflict, rent/profit/wages analysis, and the idea that capitalism could be described through impersonal economic or historical laws. Marx then took these things and drove them in a far more radical direction
 
Regarding the other question, I'd say it could absolutely exist without Ricardo because Marx also drew from (terrible) German philosophy, French socialism, Hegelian dialectics, Ludwig Feuerbach, class politics, revolutionary movements, and earlier socialist thought.
Thats true as Communism explicitly uses dialectics and Marx was very much a product of his time. His calling Smith and Ricardo "historically justified" has always been very funny to me with its irony. And Marx could scarcely contain his utter seething at the Utopian Socialists. No scorn is more heartfelt than for ideological rivals.

Slady, to your point about the dangers of publishing bad theory applies to good theory too. I am reminded of CS Peirce renaming his philosophy and framework of Pragmatism to Pragmaticism to keep it safe from "kidnappers."
 
Slady, to your point about the dangers of publishing bad theory applies to good theory too. I am reminded of CS Peirce renaming his philosophy and framework of Pragmatism to Pragmaticism to keep it safe from "kidnappers."
Not something I'm familiar with
My view of pragmatism is very objectivist, in that I consider it to mean acting against principles (condensed identifications of causal reality) for some allegedly practical gain. In other words, it's not just shit, but ultimately self-contradictory.
But from a quick lookup, this pragmaticism is entirely different.
 
But from a quick lookup, this pragmaticism is entirely different.
Pragmatic(ist) critiques of communism are that it is immune to evidence and that it consistently fails to solve the problems that it describes.

For Peirce, inquiry must be distributed and be free of coercion.

In my view, Marx was more a secular prophet than an economist or philosopher. Its why opponents of communism are often characterized as moral opponents.
 
In my view, Marx was more a secular prophet than an economist or philosopher. Its why opponents of communism are often characterized as moral opponents.
I yearn for the day when philosophy is regularly considered a fundamental cognitive discipline and not just an insulting synonym for creative writing
 
Karl Marx was the kind of guy who decided that for the mathematical definition of the derivation you're actually dividing by 0, and then wrote nonsensical texts about it.
And Friedrich Engels, in a pattern of behaviour frighteningly familiar, then fully adopted this nonsensical view and proceeded to call everyone dumb who didn't believe in it.
Marx wouldn't change his mind today.
 
Marx, like all Communists (specifically Judeo-Communists), wouldn't change his rhetoric or tactics one single bit despite the millions upon millions of innocents around the globe killed by his kike doctrine over the course of the 20th century.
 
Marx was just a secular hegelian that used the theories of Ricardo (Ricardo believed that everything is measurable by labour and should be valued by it) in order to justify how we could go to paradise.
Hegel is the culprit of everything bad in this planet, he was a XIX century version of those dudes on /pol/ that worshiped trump as a god and when trump didn't enact total nigger/tranny/kike/pajeet/moroccan/gypsy/spic/whatever you hate death or destroy the deep state, the faggots just started to scream: (TRUST THE PLAN, TWO MORE WEEKS, TWO MORE WEEKS AND ALL THE PEOPLE VAXXED WILL DIE IN HORRIBLE PAIN, Q IS TELLING ME THINGS....).
Not only hegel is single responsible to turning /pol/ into a bigger shithole but he also wrote by creating unpenetrable hard to understand and interpret walls of texts that for some reason his fans believe are necessary to the message.

TLDR: Marx would be a /pol/ shitposter that ballwash nigeria as the last bastion of the white race
 
I disagree with the comments in this thread saying he wouldn't change. He would. One of the core conceits of Marxism is that capitalism would inevitably contradict itself out of existence and naturally pave the way for Marxism/communism.

Obviously in today's world he would see that that never happened and he'd have to contrive a new explanation for why it didn't, as many modern communists do. The mental gymnastics would be off the fucking wall.

@bulletttproof interested in hearing what you thought he was right about.
 
I disagree with the comments in this thread saying he wouldn't change. He would. One of the core conceits of Marxism is that capitalism would inevitably contradict itself out of existence and naturally pave the way for Marxism/communism.

Obviously in today's world he would see that that never happened and he'd have to contrive a new explanation for why it didn't, as many modern communists do. The mental gymnastics would be off the fucking wall.

@bulletttproof interested in hearing what you thought he was right about.
That's not changing, that's just coping.
 
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