DC Comics Multimedia General - A crisis of infinite fuck ups

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I am certain that Superman can handle Bane. No one complains about him. Would Superman be able to take such characters on? Sure but he has his own problems. Maybe Typhon would be a reason for a crossover event.


What she needs is apprentices. Have her train Amazons in interacting with the rest of the world. Have them meet Steve, his team of soldiers, women in power, other supers etc etc. Showing WW through the eyes of someone new can be rejuvenating. She needs better cast. Batman's continued popularity is partly due to his extended family and his chemistry with them. Have that happen with WW.

Also always have her looking for the best in people, she doesn't have to be naive, since she has been around our world for a while, but have see the best in it since she is an outsider. Instead of making angry as so many writers do, have her approach it with a hopefulness and optimism that even if it gets knocked down by the real world never completely goes away, that is one of the things that went over so well with people about the first WW movie and it is a good basis to build on. Have her not be blind to the problems of the world, but have her also see things like the current moon missions or the way people will use the internet to raise money to help someone in another country they have never met as good things and have her point that out whenever the other Amazon's she is teaching get down on the outside world.

Oh and I can not say this strongly enough either have a will they wouldn't they thing with Batman or keep Steve alive and give her a real relationship with them. Female readers and viewers tune out if their isn't some form of relationship stuff for them to watch. It doesn't have to take over the adventure story but one of the reasons the original Spider-Man trilogy did so well was it had a good comic book action story for the guys and all the girls I knew at the time were hooked on the Peter MJ relationship. So give her some form of well written romance subplot in all media to give her broad appeal.
 
I like the idea of giving WW a classification of enemies that are more distinctly hers than Batman's or Superman's. Whether the Greek pantheon works for that or not (and they've made worse ideas work in comics), the rationale behind the idea is a good one.

I also really like the ideas for her equipment. This lets her still be "peak Amazon" as it was put but also more than that but without a contrived reason. She's a princess. She should get given the best toys.

My own way to distinguish her from Superman and Batman, back in the thread somewhere, was in terms of morality and personality. She's the only one of the three who is a soldier. The only one who is openly a warrior. Superman is great and honourable but he's a civilian in many ways, an ordinary person doing his civic duty to help because he can. Batman is the opposite - no special powers but he is far from ordinary. But he is also not a soldier, not even a special ops sort. He's a rogue agent, a half-criminal himself. If you had to give him an equivalent job role he'd be more like a CIA agent or a deep cover detective, living on the line. He can fight, but he's not a soldier.

Diana is the warrior-soldier. She uses a sword, a killing weapon. She isn't a martial artist like Batman, she's trained to fight alongside her sisters in battle formation. You put this role alongside Batman and Superman and you have all sorts of nice demarcations.

Superman: face, leadership, presidential, humble, extraordinary threats to the planet, inspirational and approachable.

Batman: intelligence, deception, frightening, extreme, equipped to deal with murderers and psychopaths, street and organized crime, undercover.

Wonder Woman: Military liaison, politically adept, tactician, dispatcher of threats with lethal force - morally uncontroversial because she's a soldier and fighting neither petty crooks nor an unappointed civillian, but rather fighting enemies that would probably be classed as an invading force. She can draw on Batman for Intelligence. She can defer to Superman as the charismatic public leader who whilst not naive, strives to keep his hands clean.

I guess this is in some ways my own variant on @BubbaRobot887 's Greek gods idea - both seeking some defining her as different through having different enemies. Though mine is more of a general theme than a specific. Batman isn't going to fight alongside the army (or shouldn't), Superman also is someone who is there to rescue and protect, not to participate. Diana is the earthly one who you could see standing around a table with generals discussing how to defeat the invading Byalian forces that Darkseid or Ares or Intergang have subverted as proxies. Things like that.

EDIT:
What she needs is apprentices. Have her train Amazons in interacting with the rest of the world. Have them meet Steve, his team of soldiers, women in power, other supers etc etc. Showing WW through the eyes of someone new can be rejuvenating. She needs better cast. Batman's continued popularity is partly due to his extended family and his chemistry with them. Have that happen with WW.
Build out her supporting cast of soldiers and army types. She already has a natural path into that with both Steve Trevor and her role as a political figure. A four star general may not be able to punch a whole in concrete but he's a powerful figure who can talk to her on her level.
 
If both sides put their differences aside and agreed it is bad, then it is really bad.
Sorry, I meant the people on this thread saying it was bad and the media acting like it's some misunderstood masterpiece.
I feel your pain, I made the exact same mistake. I thought to myself "there's absolutely no way Supergirl could be worse than Morbius, or Madame Web. There's no way Warner Brothers executives would allow James Gunn to fuck up the newly rebooted DCEU that badly..." Oh, how naive I was.
I wouldn't even call it as bad as Morbius. I personally thought Catwoman was a worse spin-off film overall. Supergirl was just dull.
the Lasso of Truth makes interrogations boring
It's one of those tools that the writer need to dance around to make sure stories don't end in five pages, sort of like Ghost Rider's Penance Stare.
No. The Batman Beyond era is the canonical future of the DCAU. They even doubled down on Justice League by linking the whole Cadmus plot to explain why Terry Is Bruce's son

It's canon that the Kevin Conroy Batman ended up single. All shippers lost.
At least Diana is alive, unlike Talia.
But even best case in the DCAU + Batman Beyond universe, and its expansion in the comics, Bruce really did a good job burning his bridges.
Hey, he still got a dog that doesn't hate him.
 
Build out her supporting cast of soldiers and army types. She already has a natural path into that with both Steve Trevor and her role as a political figure. A four star general may not be able to punch a whole in concrete but he's a powerful figure who can talk to her on her level.
Have her team up with similar analogues to her status from other pantheons. Do a tournament arc in the vein of Iron Fist where he had to duke it out with other divine weapons and they all became buddies for a little while. Diana the Amazon (the most balanced in terms of personality), a hot-blooded Valkyrie, a stoic and chaste warrior Christian nun, a slutty Arabian courtesan or Japanese Geisha to add some spice, etc. etc. Maybe throw in a ringer like Cheetah who got in on name cred only. They all show up to have a big battle in honor of the Earth mother or some shit and then, whammo, plot happens. Look at how popular Knight of the Seven Kingdoms was - people eat this shit up. If any of the OC's become fan favorites, you add them to the regular cast. It worked for Damian with Flatline in that one arc, so why reinvent the wheel?
 
For years I've been saying this: My favorite director picks for a Superman movie are Brad Bird and Sam Raimi.

I was actually very gung ho about the thought of Brad Bird being the director, and then I saw The Incredibles 2, so ... Now it's more of a mild recommendation lol.

And Sam Raimi showed more reverence to Superman in his Spider-Man movies than any Superman movie made since Superman II. Sam Raimi understands what being a hero is, at the very least. It's also common knowledge that Raimi's favorite superheroes have always been Supes and Spidey, so an actual fan would be making the movie.

Hollywood executives need to grow a spine and tell Gunn to stop making the same GOTG movie since 2014. The market and climate of the industry has changed.
I maintain that the first GOTG is still great. I can watch it anytime. Sure, there's lots of humor throughout, but the serious moments in that movie were actually played out seriously without being interrupted by some "millennial quirk chungus" joke, and I find the climax of the movie to be thematically one of the strongest in the MCU.

But yeah, people keep chasing it. Let it rest, it's been 12 years. lol.
 
Raimi would be good. Bruce Campbell could be Perry White.
Not to derail the thread, but I'm still mad/sad that we never got to see a Raimi Spider-Man sequel with Bruce Campbell as Mysterio ... The potential, man!

Anyway, I hope that Bruce Campbell is doing well while he's being treated for his cancer. I love that guy.
 
Also always have her looking for the best in people, she doesn't have to be naive, since she has been around our world for a while, but have see the best in it since she is an outsider. Instead of making angry as so many writers do, have her approach it with a hopefulness and optimism that even if it gets knocked down by the real world never completely goes away, that is one of the things that went over so well with people about the first WW movie and it is a good basis to build on. Have her not be blind to the problems of the world, but have her also see things like the current moon missions or the way people will use the internet to raise money to help someone in another country they have never met as good things and have her point that out whenever the other Amazon's she is teaching get down on the outside world.
Exactly, she should see the bad but also the good. Have her teach the Amazons that the world isn't black and white.

I like the idea of giving WW a classification of enemies that are more distinctly hers than Batman's or Superman's. Whether the Greek pantheon works for that or not (and they've made worse ideas work in comics), the rationale behind the idea is a good one.

I also really like the ideas for her equipment. This lets her still be "peak Amazon" as it was put but also more than that but without a contrived reason. She's a princess. She should get given the best toys.

My own way to distinguish her from Superman and Batman, back in the thread somewhere, was in terms of morality and personality. She's the only one of the three who is a soldier. The only one who is openly a warrior. Superman is great and honourable but he's a civilian in many ways, an ordinary person doing his civic duty to help because he can. Batman is the opposite - no special powers but he is far from ordinary. But he is also not a soldier, not even a special ops sort. He's a rogue agent, a half-criminal himself. If you had to give him an equivalent job role he'd be more like a CIA agent or a deep cover detective, living on the line. He can fight, but he's not a soldier.

Diana is the warrior-soldier. She uses a sword, a killing weapon. She isn't a martial artist like Batman, she's trained to fight alongside her sisters in battle formation. You put this role alongside Batman and Superman and you have all sorts of nice demarcations.

Superman: face, leadership, presidential, humble, extraordinary threats to the planet, inspirational and approachable.

Batman: intelligence, deception, frightening, extreme, equipped to deal with murderers and psychopaths, street and organized crime, undercover.

Wonder Woman: Military liaison, politically adept, tactician, dispatcher of threats with lethal force - morally uncontroversial because she's a soldier and fighting neither petty crooks nor an unappointed civillian, but rather fighting enemies that would probably be classed as an invading force. She can draw on Batman for Intelligence. She can defer to Superman as the charismatic public leader who whilst not naive, strives to keep his hands clean.

I guess this is in some ways my own variant on @BubbaRobot887 's Greek gods idea - both seeking some defining her as different through having different enemies. Though mine is more of a general theme than a specific. Batman isn't going to fight alongside the army (or shouldn't), Superman also is someone who is there to rescue and protect, not to participate. Diana is the earthly one who you could see standing around a table with generals discussing how to defeat the invading Byalian forces that Darkseid or Ares or Intergang have subverted as proxies. Things like that.
I think that Diana should LEARN about diplomacy/politics as a way to better represent her people. It should be a work-in-progress rather than a skill she already knows. Also, she shouldn't kill or dismember willy nilly. Her sword should be an option but only as a last resort. She is still a traditional superhero and a representative of a foreign nation. Too much violence should be against her mission. Having her fight enemies from myths all over would be a good way to distinguish her from her contemporaries.

Diana the Amazon (the most balanced in terms of personality), a hot-blooded Valkyrie, a stoic and chaste warrior Christian nun, a slutty Arabian courtesan or Japanese Geisha to add some spice,
Not bad choices but they don't exactly fit. A Valkyrie is fine, a Christian warrior nun makes no sense (monks/nuns practice non-violence unless absolutely necessary), an Arabian courtesan would be interesting but a bit overdone. Geisha makes no sense either. "Geisha" means "person of arts". "Artist" for short. "Onna Musha (Warrior Woman)" would be the term you are looking for. "Onna Bugeisha (Female Martial Artist)" would fit too but less so. In any case, I recommend that you check out warrior women of the world for inspiration.

A way this could work is if WW tried to learn about warrior women AFTER the Amazons left for Paradise Island.

For years I've been saying this: My favorite director picks for a Superman movie are Brad Bird and Sam Raimi.

I was actually very gung ho about the thought of Brad Bird being the director, and then I saw The Incredibles 2, so ... Now it's more of a mild recommendation lol.

And Sam Raimi showed more reverence to Superman in his Spider-Man movies than any Superman movie made since Superman II. Sam Raimi understands what being a hero is, at the very least. It's also common knowledge that Raimi's favorite superheroes have always been Supes and Spidey, so an actual fan would be making the movie.
Sam Raimi is the right person for Gunn's job.

I maintain that the first GOTG is still great. I can watch it anytime. Sure, there's lots of humor throughout, but the serious moments in that movie were actually played out seriously without being interrupted by some "millennial quirk chungus" joke, and I find the climax of the movie to be thematically one of the strongest in the MCU.

But yeah, people keep chasing it. Let it rest, it's been 12 years. lol.
I think GOTG works because it is GOTG. Trying to turn Superman into GOTG doesn't work. I can see it working with Red Hood and the Outlaws though.
 
When it comes to Wonder Woman's sword I think she should treat it the way Robin Hood did in the film The Adventures of Robin Hood where he said "My black arrow is the weapon of last resort and it's verdict is always final", he sword should only leave its sheath when she intends to kill someone so it rarely happens and when it does the thing she is taking on is so evil she does not hesitate. In other words you know when it happens the story is epic and it has reached its climax.

I think one use for the lasso of truth could go hand in hand with her preferring to talk people down when she can, maybe the truths it can reveal can be just as much a revaluation to the person speaking them as to her. They see what their true motivations are and rethink their actions. Like maybe a teenager had been brainwashed since birth to be a suicide bomber and she uses it to show them that deep down the only reason they believe they have to do this is because that is what the people who abused them all their lives told them they had to do and they see the act of suicide as the only way out of a life where they are treated as a weapon and not a human, since she is holding the lasso as well she can't lie to them when she tells them she cares what happens to them and the bomber disarms the bomb.

Not sure if that idea is any good but it is one that just popped into my head.

I would much rather have Sam Rami running then Gunn but I do have to wonder if he would just pulled what he did in the last Doctor Strange movie and give us the perfect casting for a bunch of heroes and then brutally murder them five minutes latter.
 
You can have a cabal of demigods trying to control the world behind everyone's back. That could work.
What if one of them keeps using his or her powers to keep bringing The Joker back to life?

Then you can have The Joker be an ongoing threat that stands above everyone else without having the people of Gotham being idiots who refuse to execute this psycho who has murdered hundreds of people. They do take action against him but he will not stay down and he gets more and more crazy every time he is brought back.
 
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