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The label fuckery is strong with this one.
Nazis are antisemitic. If you’re in the process of remaining the Fatherland call yourself a white supremicist or a klan member, but if your a Nazi, you’re antisemitic.

oAlso, are Ex-gays a thing? I know they’re a thing in Christian comic books, an maybe a few kids who turned out bi, but I’ve never really heard of an “ex gay” before
Ex gays are a thing in the Christian fundie world, yes.
 
If you play on roleplay server in WoW you will be greeted by a large number of furries, troons, and furry troons. I told one to stop talking about his dick and self identified lesbianism and he started screeching that I was "attacking his qweeer identity!"
(Yes I've played on a rp server because the degenerates are entertaining.)
Europe pretty much only have one good RP realm, whereas US infamously have Moon Guard for degenerates and Wyrmrest Accord for elitists.

The EU realm has a decent amount of tolerable RP'ers, but you'll very specifically find these nutjob troons in a few select areas. The ones that trolls hang out in, obviously. Trolls, tourists, and sex workers; Goldshire. It's almost as if the realize that's where they belong/find equal minded people.

If you play an entire god damn roleplaying mmo and only find 'your kind' in a sex den, it should be quite obvious that it's a fetish.
 
Reddit dump:

Troon proves that "non-binaries" existed by siting Wikipedia- the most creditable source known to man:
Wyświetl załącznik 1796764
https://www.reddit.com/r/traaaaaaannnnnnnnnns/comments/kfmagd/remember_that_weve_always_existed/ (Archive)

"Risk permanent destructive changes to your body because of your confused feelings!".
Wyświetl załącznik 1796783
https://www.reddit.com/r/traaaaaaan.../identity_is_fluid_the_nonpermanent_parts_of/ (Archive)

Remember, it's definitely not a fetish:
Wyświetl załącznik 1796799
https://www.reddit.com/r/MtF/comments/kfowq1/be_her_or_bng_her/ (Archive)

When you're questioning whether or not you should mutilate your body versus when you decided against it:

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Laverly published a piece full of lies in some paper. Jesse Singal tore it apart in this twitter thread. (big mess. I will type it out if I get the time). Here is Laverly's persuasive response

Wyświetl załącznik 1796569Wyświetl załącznik 1796572

Plus the first reply to the tweet in which he uploaded this

Wyświetl załącznik 1796573
Lavery is really screeching about this. Don't worry about cleaning up the thread - Jesse did a free substack going through some (not all) of Laverys points. It's right here. (Substack, no paywall) As I read it, it's pretty much the Twitter thread expanded for legibility.

Lavery's response is some next-level batshit, though - I particularly like the title, which makes this most harmless Jewish boy from NYC sound, like, really metal. Way to go, Grace! And this person teaches English... ye gods and little fishes, I would want my money back. He's completely unable to communicate in a coherent fashion.

Hopefully this is the start of gay men speaking out about troons. The surge of TIF that go after gay men must be on the rise. Correlating with the cases of girls thinking they're trans. Hopefully. Crossing my fingers.
This is actually kind of funny. Trans don’t even know what womanhood is. Both manhood and womanhood are subjective. It means something different to different people.

An argument I always like to offer is “what does being a man (or woman) feel like/ what is manhood (or womanhood)” When they answer with stereotypical gender shit, just respond with “well, I don’t feel like a man (or woman), and I’m not trans. I just know that I am one.”


Those are called TEHMs, friend. Something I’ve noticed a lot of people here don’t know about. They’re abundant. Not as rampant as TERFs, but they’re certainly out there.
Nah we are just called gay men. No more, no less. They keep trying to make TEHMs happen, but it's not going to happen - even troons think it's lame.

Obviously, gay men know what's supposed to be between someone's legs and are not shy about saying it out loud. And I've definitely noticed more and more coming out on twitter lately. My personal feeling is that not very many gay men are invested in troonery, but have mostly been afraid to speak out, as it's not been seen as our place. But when the TQ started attacking us for being exclusively same-sex attracted, well, that's going to cause some pushback. I think I've said as much on this thread a few times now. It's nice to see it's not just wishful thinking (which I would have thought about a year ago...) as evidenced by the 20 (and counting) organizations for LGB people appearing all over the world.

oAlso, are Ex-gays a thing? I know they’re a thing in Christian comic books, an maybe a few kids who turned out bi, but I’ve never really heard of an “ex gay” before
There are a few out there, but somehow they keep getting discovered in public bathrooms with a mouthful of cock. Funny that.

There was a notorious "ex-gay conversion therapy" group called Exodus where two of the founders ended up eloping with each other. Exodus apologized publicly and closed down some years ago, but the mindset is still found among Christian fundamentalists, as @Crunchy Leaf also pointed out. More here (Atlantic article; no paywall).
 
Reddit dump:

Troon proves that "non-binaries" existed by siting Wikipedia- the most creditable source known to man:
Wyświetl załącznik 1796764
https://www.reddit.com/r/traaaaaaannnnnnnnnns/comments/kfmagd/remember_that_weve_always_existed/ (Archive)

"Risk permanent destructive changes to your body because of your confused feelings!".
Wyświetl załącznik 1796783
https://www.reddit.com/r/traaaaaaan.../identity_is_fluid_the_nonpermanent_parts_of/ (Archive)

Remember, it's definitely not a fetish:
Wyświetl załącznik 1796799
https://www.reddit.com/r/MtF/comments/kfowq1/be_her_or_bng_her/ (Archive)
All of those "non binary genders" were roles for gay men or (typically) lesbian or infertile women or people with DSDs. They're all in sexist societies that have strict roles for men and women and only barely tolerate these groups by calling them somehow not "real men" or "real women". In cultures with more equality between the sexes - something you'd think the SJWs would want - you're a man or a woman based on your sex however you express yourself, and people generally do the same things (eg the Apache didn't have this whole "two spirit" thing that the Dine did, because they were so often at war, and so men and women both had to learn how to do a lot of different jobs, like how in wartime now even if it's segregated, men in the armed forces everywhere have to know how to cook and sew and women have to know how to defend the home). Albania, Arabia and India had/have high rates of female infanticide and horrific abuse of women and girls because they're second class citizens, they're not models of progressive culture.
And even in societies that have these extra genders, they've never considered them something other than their actual sex. The Samoan prime minister even criticised the troon Laurel Hubbard for competing in women's powerlifting, he said "This fa'afafine or man should have never been allowed by the Pacific Games Council president to lift with the women. I was shocked when I first heard about it".
It's strange that it's the same people who rail against cultural appropriation doing this. I guess they pick and choose whatever fits their narrative.
 
All of those "non binary genders" were roles for gay men or (typically) lesbian or infertile women. They're all in sexist societies that have strict roles for men and women and only barely tolerate these groups by calling them somehow not "real men" or "real women". In cultures with more equality between the sexes - something you'd think the SJWs would want - you're a man or a woman based on your sex however you express yourself, and people generally do the same things (eg the Apache didn't have this whole "two spirit" thing that the Dine did, because they were so often at war, and so men and women both had to learn how to do a lot of different jobs, like how in wartime now even if it's segregated, men in the armed forces everywhere have to know how to cook and sew and women have to know how to defend the home). Albania, Arabia and India had/have high rates of female infanticide and horrific abuse of women and girls because they're second class citizens, they're not models of progressive culture.
And even in societies that have these extra genders, they've never considered them something other than their actual sex. The Samoan prime minister even criticised the troon Laurel Hubbard for competing in women's powerlifting, he said "This fa'afafine or man should have never been allowed by the Pacific Games Council president to lift with the women. I was shocked when I first heard about it".
It's strange that it's the same people who rail against cultural appropriation doing this. I guess they pick and choose whatever fits their narrative.
I think this point gets raised often, but that's what makes it so fucking frustrating even attempting to communicate with people with this mindset. They are so convinced that their cause is good and righteous that even the most profoundly racist, sexist, and homophobic ideas get excused, as long as it serves the cause - or rather, as long as it's the right person saying this shit. The whole "transwomen are women like black women are women"-trope is a particular pet peeve of mine. And yes, the whole two-spirit thing. And the appropriation of intersex conditions. And the re-writing of LGB history.... OK, I'll stop now before I have an aneurysm.

I guess if you're lying to yourself and everyone else from the moment you wake every day, casually lying about all this other stuff comes easy.
 
The simple existence of the term TEHM is just more proof that TERF is intended for women only - and more specifically non-compliant lesbians.
No, straight women too. JK Rowling isn’t a lesbian and neither are most women on mumsnet. And I’ve seen guys get called TERFs before — not to the same degree, sure, but men do get cancelled in certain circles for this.
 
The line about puberty blocking intrigued me so I did some internet research (I know, I know). Looks like puberty blockers are only supposed to be a first step, lasting 2 years tops, so if the person taking them starts at 14, they should be off by 16. It’s basically a way to “buy time”

So then I thought to myself, what would happen if a doctor just kept prescribing these things. Sure, someone could probably get away with delaying puberty up until 18-19 and still get away with it. Plenty of late-bloomers could attest to that, but what happens if you’re in these things till 30?
Well, short answer, no one knows. Long answer though is that there are several papers trying to extrapolate what would happen (most of which seem very neutral or pro-trans modifications). A few points brought up:

Bone density: yeah this has the potential of fucking you up as you age

Diabeties/Obesity/Kidney&liver issues: this comes from studies of post-menopausal women and older men with low T. The paper admits that this might not hold true for someone who has never entered puberty, but it’s something to keep an eye on.

Genitalia: obviously they wouldn’t develop, and there were talks about the organs going into atrophy. Not to mention the ability to reproduce. There was also a brief discussion that pre-pubescent genitalia are unsuited for many “bottom” surgeries. They didn’t go into too much detail about this except to say that there wouldn’t be enough skin, and I didn’t look any further!

Brain development: this is the one that blew me. The onset of puberty tends to correlate with a rise in executive functioning and generally getting a grown-ups brain. Now, they admit, no one is 100% sure if there’s even a connection there, but the idea the hormones would affect the brain isn’t out of the realm of logic. Long term use could trap individuals in child-like brains without the ability to gain higher functions of thought. There were a few studies trying to do cognitive tests on cis and trans kids but honestly they looked like shit.

A concern of mine that I didn’t see explored, Cancer: I am not a doctor, nor am I doctor adjacent. But I have noticed a Trend that, when a body has an organ it isn’t using, that organs gettin cancer. So, while (natural) late onset puberty correlates with a decreased instance in gonad cancer, I can’t help but wonder if long term blockers would instigate cancer in either the gonads or the pituitary. Again, this is pure conjecture on my part based on what little I know of medicine. Happy to be out in my place.

Mind you, none of this has happened or is happening. Everything I read spoke in hypotheticals. I couldn’t even find any animal studies though maybe someone with better PubMed skills could give a look. Just thought it would be an interesting look
I read a few write ups but this one is pretty complete and touches on all bases (has a huge ethics section too if you’re interested). https://jme.bmj.com/content/46/11/743

Imo. You don't need to break it down by looking at blockers and thinking, maybe it's bad? Consider that if you had a disease that stopped you from having a puberty it would be a major concern. It's a process you have to go through to become an adult. It's not a 'maybe' it's an absolute that blocking your puberty for a long time would not be wise because it will absolutely have a negative effect on the body. It's also been hypothesized that puberty has a window and that long term prevention of it means it will never happen, causing the person to be trapped in an underdeveloped but still aging body.

If a woman has a hormonal issue that makes her naturally have very high T, or vice versa. It's deemed a medical issue. This is one of the major problems with the trans lobby. It's stopping science from being as hard on the idea of transition through the use of drugs because they prevent the studies from occurring or shut them down when they find out, preventing the data from existing because deep down they all know it will not be good. Anything that puberty blockers do OR HRT do for a trans person in a healthy adult is considered a major issue biologically that needs to be addressed because it's a sign of sickness, bodily disfunction, and increases your chances of having other issues.

There's a reason that endocrinologists exist because hormones play such a huge role in human development and health. There's a reason we know high T, low T, high estrogen, low estrogen, are problems that need to be medically address, but for troons we're supposed to handwave the possibility of them absolutely causing harm to themselves. ( As an aside it's hilarious that healthline use people with penises and people with vulva for the High T articles because the type of person who is a 'person who has vulva' and has high T probably has it artificially induced. Women with High T would be aware it's a medical issue. )

Eventually something will happen, these aren't maybes and plenty of doctors and scientist are very much aware of that, and these studies that have been prevented will occur and the results from them will not be good.
 
The simple existence of the term TEHM is just more proof that TERF is intended for women only - and more specifically non-compliant lesbians.
No, straight women too. JK Rowling isn’t a lesbian and neither are most women on mumsnet. And I’ve seen guys get called TERFs before — not to the same degree, sure, but men do get cancelled in certain circles for this.
TERF, I think, is a catch-all for anyone who is not compliant with troon ideology. I've been called it and even if I am sympathetic to many feminist ideas and ideals, I am by no means one myself. And I think the primary reason TEHM isn't catching on is that it's primarily used by fujos against gay men, so it's a much smaller group that no-one really cares about.
 
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