US to let Turkish forces move into Syria, dumping Kurdish alliesWhite House reveals policy shift, which follows conversation between Trump and Erdoğan
www.theguardian.com
Julian Borger - October 7, 2019 The White House has given the green light to a Turkish offensive into northern Syria, moving US forces out of the area in an abrupt foreign policy change that will in effect abandon Washington’s longtime allies, the Kurds. Kurdish forces have spearheaded the campaign against Islamic State in the region, but the policy swerve, after a phone conversation between Donald Trump and Recep Tayyip Erdoğan on Sunday, means Turkey would take custody of captured Isis fighters, the White House said. It has also raised fears of fresh fighting between Turkey and Kurdish forces in Syria’s complex war now the US no longer acts as a buffer between the two sides. The Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF) said on Monday morning that their US partners had already begun withdrawing troops from areas along Turkey’s border. Footage aired on Kurdish news agency Hawar purportedly showed US armoured vehicles leaving positions near the towns of Ras al-Ayn and Tal Abyad in the border region. The SDF spokesman, Mustafa Bali, accused the US of leaving the area to “turn into a war zone”, adding that the SDF would “defend north-east Syria at all costs”. A statement from the Turkish foreign minister, Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu, also early on Monday said that Ankara had “supported the territorial integrity of Syria since the beginning of the crisis and will continue to do so … [We are] determined to ensure survivability and security of Turkey by clearing the region from terrorists. We will contribute to bringing safety, peace and stability to Syria.” The decision represents the latest in a series of erratic moves by Trump, fighting impeachment at home, apparently taken without consultation with, or knowledge of, US diplomats dealing with Syria. Ruben Gallego, an Iraq war veteran and Democratic congressman from Arizona, tweeted: “Allowing Turkey to move into northern Syria is one of the most destabilising moves we can do in the Middle East. The Kurds will never trust America again. They will look for new alliances or independence to protect themselves.” In August, the US and Turkey came to an agreement to create a “safe zone” in northern Syria, by which the US-backed Kurdish-led SDF would pull back from the border. Ankara sees the SDF as indistinguishable from Kurdish insurgents inside Turkey and views it as a serious security threat. The safe zone deal was due to forestall a Turkish military offensive. In the White House statement issued just before 11 pm on Sunday, however, that agreement was not mentioned. “Today, President Donald J Trump spoke with President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan of Turkey by telephone,” the surprise statement said. “Turkey will soon be moving forward with its long-planned operation into northern Syria. The United States Armed Forces will not support or be involved in the operation, and United States forces, having defeated the Isis territorial ‘caliphate’, will no longer be in the immediate area.” The statement suggested that in return for US acquiescence in a Turkish offensive, Erdoğan had assured Trump that Turkey would take over the detention of Isis militants captured by the SDF, on the battlefield. The custody of Europeans and other foreign fighters has long been one of Trump’s preoccupations, and he has lambasted European governments for not taking responsibility for their own nationals in Isis ranks. “The US government has pressed France, Germany, and other European nations, from which many captured Isis fighters came, to take them back, but they did not want them and refused,” the White House statement continued. “The US will not hold them for what could be many years and great cost to the United States taxpayer. Turkey will now be responsible for all Isis fighters in the area captured over the past two years in the wake of the defeat of the territorial caliphate by the United States.” Syria experts warned that the US abandonment of the SDF would lead to another, new front in the eight-year Syrian conflict, and could push the Kurds into seeking an arrangement with the Assad regime in Damascus. Two weeks ago, at the UN general assembly, the US special envoy for the global coalition to defeat Isis, James Jeffrey, stressed that the US had an agreement with Turkey on a safe zone, in recognition of Ankara’s security concerns, that obviated the need for an Turkish incursion. “We listen to the Turks’ concerns. We try to respond to them when we can,” Jeffrey said. “And we have made it clear to Turkey at every level that any unilateral operation is not going to lead to an improvement in anyone’s security – not Turkey’s, not the people in the north-east, not the people around the world who feel threatened by Daesh [Isis], which is the basic purpose for our US military being in the north-east in the first place.” Another outcome of the Trump-Erdoğan call is that the Turkish leader is expected to visit the White House next month. |
War US to let Turkish forces move into Syria, dumping Kurdish allies - White House reveals policy shift, which follows conversation between Trump and Erdoğan
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- Dołączono
- 8 Lip 2019
No you don't. When you said things have improved under Trump I knew you were lying. Things have not gotten better, Kim is still saber rattling, and launching missiles.
KingElizabeth
kiwifarms.net
- Dołączono
- 28 Lip 2019
Since the Kurds are now allies with Syria, firing upon the militia should be the same as firing upon the Syrian army? Does the Turkish government not care and invaded the Kurdish held lands with full intention of duking it out with Assad if need be?
- Dołączono
- 4 Lis 2017
You know who hasn't come out butt-blasted on this? Actual Kurdish government representatives. It's all American politicians and various white socialist orgs, and the usual smattering of Orange Man Bad hiveminders.
Kurdish Militia want to kill Turks. Repeat it with me Kurdish Militia want to kill Turks. They got five glorious years of it, and knew the party was going to end eventually.
Yes. Turkey doesn't care about Syria. If they thought they could get away with it, they'd just take over. (But they can't. Even if they somehow got Russia, US and Europe to sign off on it, it would turn the entire region against them and would leave them isolated politcally, which Erdogen doesn't want as he is trying to become a "third axis" as an alternative to the Iran/SA influence wars ). Turkey cares MILDLY about Russia, in so much as NATO is a purely defensive pact and if you go an poke the bear by attacking their military, you might be left hung out to dry.
Turkey wants to create a "safe zone" inside syria to resettle the 4-million some refugees currently in Turkey. Their reasons are two fold. Firstly, it gets Syrian refugees out of Turkey so they aren't Turkey's problem anymore. Secondly, it dumps a whole lot of non-Kurdish people in to an area that previously had small Kurdish enclaves. Its population replacement, the hope is that they will neuter the Kurds as a political force in the region or, Allah willing, the refugees will do what anyone does when they are poor, exhausted, and dumped into a strange area: blame minorities and start ethnic cleansing.
At the moment, Turkey can operate with some plausible deniability by claiming the Kurds are not uniformed, so they dont' know who is who, fog of war, etc. Syria is not in any shape to challenge them, and the excuse, while lame, is enough to carry water for a bit.
Kurdish Militia want to kill Turks. Repeat it with me Kurdish Militia want to kill Turks. They got five glorious years of it, and knew the party was going to end eventually.
Yes. Turkey doesn't care about Syria. If they thought they could get away with it, they'd just take over. (But they can't. Even if they somehow got Russia, US and Europe to sign off on it, it would turn the entire region against them and would leave them isolated politcally, which Erdogen doesn't want as he is trying to become a "third axis" as an alternative to the Iran/SA influence wars ). Turkey cares MILDLY about Russia, in so much as NATO is a purely defensive pact and if you go an poke the bear by attacking their military, you might be left hung out to dry.
Turkey wants to create a "safe zone" inside syria to resettle the 4-million some refugees currently in Turkey. Their reasons are two fold. Firstly, it gets Syrian refugees out of Turkey so they aren't Turkey's problem anymore. Secondly, it dumps a whole lot of non-Kurdish people in to an area that previously had small Kurdish enclaves. Its population replacement, the hope is that they will neuter the Kurds as a political force in the region or, Allah willing, the refugees will do what anyone does when they are poor, exhausted, and dumped into a strange area: blame minorities and start ethnic cleansing.
At the moment, Turkey can operate with some plausible deniability by claiming the Kurds are not uniformed, so they dont' know who is who, fog of war, etc. Syria is not in any shape to challenge them, and the excuse, while lame, is enough to carry water for a bit.
- Dołączono
- 13 Lip 2019
Ok, so we regularly deploy troops to SA. That's never going to stop. It's part of our deal with having military bases within their country. I think we rotate, roughly, company support elements to full brigade deployments.
We have done this, off and on, for a long time. Also, what Trump meant by "paying us":
The Saudis are paying for the mobilizations and troop upkeep. They aren't handing Trump 'free money', what do you believe he was referring to?
This is very different from the Syrian Kurds: who we arm, train, and gave access to air power and artillery.
Significant amount of upkeep, with no real economic payoff.
I think we should also be careful(everyone), lumping the Syrian kurds, with the Iraqi Kurds.
Although having a similar goal, an independent ethnosate, the two groups are completely different. In terms of approaches, ideology, regional tensions, infrastructure etc etc.
The PUK and PKK aren't even remotely synonymous. We still openly support the Iraqi Kurds, and will continue to do so...
- Dołączono
- 7 Wrz 2016
US troops express anger at Trump's Syria policy: 'We betrayed' the Kurds
https://edition.cnn.com/profiles/ryan-browne
By Ryan Browne, CNN
Updated 1131 GMT (1931 HKT) October 15, 2019
Washington (CNN)
A wide range of American military personnel and defense officials are expressing a deep sense of frustration and anger at the Trump administration's refusal to support Syrian Kurds facing a Turkish military assault, over half a dozen US military and defense officials have told CNN.
Several US military and defense officials, including personnel deployed to Syria, expressed dismay at how the Trump administration has handled the situation.
One US official said it is well known that some senior US military officials are livid at how the Kurds have been treated given their role in helping the US fight ISIS.
Another senior American defense official told CNN that Trump's failure to more forcefully oppose the invasion or do anything to stop the attacks on the Kurds meant Trump had given Turkey a green light, despite the administration's public stance that it had consistently opposed the operation.
The Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces "are fighting a force that intends to eliminate their people because we green lighted their operation," a senior US defense official told CNN referring to the Turkish operation.
Another US military official involved in operations in Syria said he was "ashamed" of his country's actions with regards to the Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces, saying the US had failed to defend its one-time ally in the fight against ISIS.
Loss of trust
There's also a concern that allies and potential partners won't trust the US in the future.
"How do we expect anyone to partner with us now?" one US defense official told CNN.
"They did everything we asked them to do," said another. "This is really not good for us."
Turkey launched its long threatened incursion into the country after Trump ordered a small contingent of about 50 US troops to be pulled back from the border area amid a belief that a Turkish assault was imminent.
While Trump administration officials have argued that Turkey would have attacked the Kurds even if US troops had remained, the Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces and a large bipartisan group of US lawmakers have slammed Trump for not opposing the Turkish operation more forcefully and for taking no concrete action to stop it.
Republican lawmakers in particular have harshly denounced Trump's decision as a betrayal of the Kurds and a strategic blunder that will weaken American credibility, reverse gains against ISIS, make it harder for the US to build alliances and give a boost to Russia and Iran.
The Trump administration belatedly sought to halt the Turkish advance Monday, announcing a series of sanctions targeting Turkey's Defense, Energy and Interior ministers as well as the Defense and Energy ministries.
Vice President Mike Pence also revealed that Trump had spoken with both Turkey's President Erdogan and the Kurdish-leader of the Syrian Democratic Forces, Gen. Mazloum Kobani Abdi, adding that Trump had "received a firm commitment" from Erdogan not to attack the Syrian Kurdish city of Kobani, a location considered to be critical to the SDF.
Pence said the US was also working to set up a ceasefire between the warring factions. However, given Trump's order to withdraw all US troops from the area, the US will find it hard to monitor much less enforce such a ceasefire and it's unclear how much leverage the US will have to impact the situation on the ground with one official calling it "too little, too late."
Some of the frustration among US personnel is based on the fact that in order to appease Turkey, the US convinced the Syrian Kurds to dismantle their defensive fortifications along the border and pull their fighters back. The US said Turkey had agreed to the arrangement which sought to prevent unilateral Turkish military action and also provided Turkey with US intelligence about the border area.
Cognizant of Turkey's enmity towards Syrian Kurdish groups, the US also resisted arming Kurdish elements of the SDF, only doing so in 2017. The US also only provided both Arabs and Kurds in the SDF with light arms such as Ak-47 rifles and did not arm them with heavy weapons that could be used against a modern military equipped with tanks, artillery and warplanes like Turkey's.
But despite those efforts to appease Ankara, Turkey launched its invasion.
Senior members of the Trump administration have insisted that the US has not deserted the Syrian Kurds.
Secretary of Defense Mark Esper claimed Friday that the US is not abandoning its Kurdish allies who are now under attack from Turkey's military offensive into Syria, even as he made clear the US will not intervene in the fight.
A 'betrayal'
However, troops on the ground have described it as an abandonment and a "betrayal."
"It's pretty messed up what's happening out here," one US Special Forces soldier on the ground in Syria told CNN when news of the US withdrawal was announced.
"We want to offer support," the soldier said, adding "We do not want to leave them in this situation."
Several US military officials expressed disappointment that the Pentagon and State Department were not acting with a greater sense of urgency to protect the Kurds.
On Friday the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Mark Milley said he had told the SDF not to "overreact" to the Turkish operation.
Asked about the widely publicized criticism from US Special Operations Forces about the Syria policy, Secretary of the Army Ryan McCarthy said Monday that while such "candor" was "important," he said, "When national policy decisions are made, we salute and move out."
"I like candor. It's important to have that. Obviously, you don't want to have disobedience, but you, it's definitely, they have to have opinions. Everybody has opinions, you have a war of ideas, but ultimately that they, when national policy decisions are made, we salute and move out," he told reporters.
"They should be extremely proud of what they've done. and there are higher level strategic politics involved, but as far as what our soldiers have done, what our special forces have done, they've done an incredible job over there and they ought to be very, very proud of it," Gen. James McConville, the chief of staff of the Army, said Monday while appearing beside McCarthy.
In the absence of US assistance in the face of the Turkish attack the Kurds have sought protection from the Assad regime in Damascus and their Russian military backers, something Trump tweeted Monday that he was OK with.
Trump had earlier Monday cited uncorroborated reports that Kurdish officials had released some of the 10,000 ISIS prisoners being held by the SDF, a notion that was immediately rejected by a member of his own administration.
"Falsely claiming that the SDF Kurds are letting ISIS prisoners out of prison is wrong," a senior defense official said.
This story has been updated.
CNN's Barbara Starr contributed reporting.
---
archive.li
edition.cnn.com
CNN again with their kwality sauces.
https://edition.cnn.com/profiles/ryan-browne
By Ryan Browne, CNN
Updated 1131 GMT (1931 HKT) October 15, 2019
Washington (CNN)
A wide range of American military personnel and defense officials are expressing a deep sense of frustration and anger at the Trump administration's refusal to support Syrian Kurds facing a Turkish military assault, over half a dozen US military and defense officials have told CNN.
Several US military and defense officials, including personnel deployed to Syria, expressed dismay at how the Trump administration has handled the situation.
One US official said it is well known that some senior US military officials are livid at how the Kurds have been treated given their role in helping the US fight ISIS.
Another senior American defense official told CNN that Trump's failure to more forcefully oppose the invasion or do anything to stop the attacks on the Kurds meant Trump had given Turkey a green light, despite the administration's public stance that it had consistently opposed the operation.
The Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces "are fighting a force that intends to eliminate their people because we green lighted their operation," a senior US defense official told CNN referring to the Turkish operation.
Another US military official involved in operations in Syria said he was "ashamed" of his country's actions with regards to the Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces, saying the US had failed to defend its one-time ally in the fight against ISIS.
Loss of trust
There's also a concern that allies and potential partners won't trust the US in the future.
"How do we expect anyone to partner with us now?" one US defense official told CNN.
"They did everything we asked them to do," said another. "This is really not good for us."
Turkey launched its long threatened incursion into the country after Trump ordered a small contingent of about 50 US troops to be pulled back from the border area amid a belief that a Turkish assault was imminent.
While Trump administration officials have argued that Turkey would have attacked the Kurds even if US troops had remained, the Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces and a large bipartisan group of US lawmakers have slammed Trump for not opposing the Turkish operation more forcefully and for taking no concrete action to stop it.
Republican lawmakers in particular have harshly denounced Trump's decision as a betrayal of the Kurds and a strategic blunder that will weaken American credibility, reverse gains against ISIS, make it harder for the US to build alliances and give a boost to Russia and Iran.
The Trump administration belatedly sought to halt the Turkish advance Monday, announcing a series of sanctions targeting Turkey's Defense, Energy and Interior ministers as well as the Defense and Energy ministries.
Vice President Mike Pence also revealed that Trump had spoken with both Turkey's President Erdogan and the Kurdish-leader of the Syrian Democratic Forces, Gen. Mazloum Kobani Abdi, adding that Trump had "received a firm commitment" from Erdogan not to attack the Syrian Kurdish city of Kobani, a location considered to be critical to the SDF.
Pence said the US was also working to set up a ceasefire between the warring factions. However, given Trump's order to withdraw all US troops from the area, the US will find it hard to monitor much less enforce such a ceasefire and it's unclear how much leverage the US will have to impact the situation on the ground with one official calling it "too little, too late."
Some of the frustration among US personnel is based on the fact that in order to appease Turkey, the US convinced the Syrian Kurds to dismantle their defensive fortifications along the border and pull their fighters back. The US said Turkey had agreed to the arrangement which sought to prevent unilateral Turkish military action and also provided Turkey with US intelligence about the border area.
Cognizant of Turkey's enmity towards Syrian Kurdish groups, the US also resisted arming Kurdish elements of the SDF, only doing so in 2017. The US also only provided both Arabs and Kurds in the SDF with light arms such as Ak-47 rifles and did not arm them with heavy weapons that could be used against a modern military equipped with tanks, artillery and warplanes like Turkey's.
But despite those efforts to appease Ankara, Turkey launched its invasion.
Senior members of the Trump administration have insisted that the US has not deserted the Syrian Kurds.
Secretary of Defense Mark Esper claimed Friday that the US is not abandoning its Kurdish allies who are now under attack from Turkey's military offensive into Syria, even as he made clear the US will not intervene in the fight.
A 'betrayal'
However, troops on the ground have described it as an abandonment and a "betrayal."
"It's pretty messed up what's happening out here," one US Special Forces soldier on the ground in Syria told CNN when news of the US withdrawal was announced.
"We want to offer support," the soldier said, adding "We do not want to leave them in this situation."
Several US military officials expressed disappointment that the Pentagon and State Department were not acting with a greater sense of urgency to protect the Kurds.
On Friday the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Mark Milley said he had told the SDF not to "overreact" to the Turkish operation.
Asked about the widely publicized criticism from US Special Operations Forces about the Syria policy, Secretary of the Army Ryan McCarthy said Monday that while such "candor" was "important," he said, "When national policy decisions are made, we salute and move out."
"I like candor. It's important to have that. Obviously, you don't want to have disobedience, but you, it's definitely, they have to have opinions. Everybody has opinions, you have a war of ideas, but ultimately that they, when national policy decisions are made, we salute and move out," he told reporters.
"They should be extremely proud of what they've done. and there are higher level strategic politics involved, but as far as what our soldiers have done, what our special forces have done, they've done an incredible job over there and they ought to be very, very proud of it," Gen. James McConville, the chief of staff of the Army, said Monday while appearing beside McCarthy.
In the absence of US assistance in the face of the Turkish attack the Kurds have sought protection from the Assad regime in Damascus and their Russian military backers, something Trump tweeted Monday that he was OK with.
Trump had earlier Monday cited uncorroborated reports that Kurdish officials had released some of the 10,000 ISIS prisoners being held by the SDF, a notion that was immediately rejected by a member of his own administration.
"Falsely claiming that the SDF Kurds are letting ISIS prisoners out of prison is wrong," a senior defense official said.
This story has been updated.
CNN's Barbara Starr contributed reporting.
---
Trump's Syria policy: US troops express anger at refusal to support K…
archived 15 Oct 2019 13:05:24 UTC
US troops express anger at Trump's Syria policy: 'We betrayed' the Kurds
A wide range of American military personnel and defense officials are expressing a deep sense of frustration and anger at the Trump administration's refusal to support Syrian Kurds facing a Turkish military assault, over half a dozen US military and defense officials have told CNN.
edition.cnn.com
CNN again with their kwality sauces.
Just Some Other Guy
kiwifarms.net
- Dołączono
- 25 Mar 2018
I don't think a solider and a handful of defense 'officials' count as "a wide range" of sources. But sure, whatever you say, CNN.US troops express anger at Trump's Syria policy: 'We betrayed' the Kurds
https://edition.cnn.com/profiles/ryan-browne
By Ryan Browne, CNN
Updated 1131 GMT (1931 HKT) October 15, 2019
Washington (CNN)
A wide range of American military personnel and defense officials are expressing a deep sense of frustration and anger at the Trump administration's refusal to support Syrian Kurds facing a Turkish military assault, over half a dozen US military and defense officials have told CNN.
Several US military and defense officials, including personnel deployed to Syria, expressed dismay at how the Trump administration has handled the situation.
One US official said it is well known that some senior US military officials are livid at how the Kurds have been treated given their role in helping the US fight ISIS.
Another senior American defense official told CNN that Trump's failure to more forcefully oppose the invasion or do anything to stop the attacks on the Kurds meant Trump had given Turkey a green light, despite the administration's public stance that it had consistently opposed the operation.
The Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces "are fighting a force that intends to eliminate their people because we green lighted their operation," a senior US defense official told CNN referring to the Turkish operation.
Another US military official involved in operations in Syria said he was "ashamed" of his country's actions with regards to the Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces, saying the US had failed to defend its one-time ally in the fight against ISIS.
Loss of trust
There's also a concern that allies and potential partners won't trust the US in the future.
"How do we expect anyone to partner with us now?" one US defense official told CNN.
"They did everything we asked them to do," said another. "This is really not good for us."
Turkey launched its long threatened incursion into the country after Trump ordered a small contingent of about 50 US troops to be pulled back from the border area amid a belief that a Turkish assault was imminent.
While Trump administration officials have argued that Turkey would have attacked the Kurds even if US troops had remained, the Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces and a large bipartisan group of US lawmakers have slammed Trump for not opposing the Turkish operation more forcefully and for taking no concrete action to stop it.
Republican lawmakers in particular have harshly denounced Trump's decision as a betrayal of the Kurds and a strategic blunder that will weaken American credibility, reverse gains against ISIS, make it harder for the US to build alliances and give a boost to Russia and Iran.
The Trump administration belatedly sought to halt the Turkish advance Monday, announcing a series of sanctions targeting Turkey's Defense, Energy and Interior ministers as well as the Defense and Energy ministries.
Vice President Mike Pence also revealed that Trump had spoken with both Turkey's President Erdogan and the Kurdish-leader of the Syrian Democratic Forces, Gen. Mazloum Kobani Abdi, adding that Trump had "received a firm commitment" from Erdogan not to attack the Syrian Kurdish city of Kobani, a location considered to be critical to the SDF.
Pence said the US was also working to set up a ceasefire between the warring factions. However, given Trump's order to withdraw all US troops from the area, the US will find it hard to monitor much less enforce such a ceasefire and it's unclear how much leverage the US will have to impact the situation on the ground with one official calling it "too little, too late."
Some of the frustration among US personnel is based on the fact that in order to appease Turkey, the US convinced the Syrian Kurds to dismantle their defensive fortifications along the border and pull their fighters back. The US said Turkey had agreed to the arrangement which sought to prevent unilateral Turkish military action and also provided Turkey with US intelligence about the border area.
Cognizant of Turkey's enmity towards Syrian Kurdish groups, the US also resisted arming Kurdish elements of the SDF, only doing so in 2017. The US also only provided both Arabs and Kurds in the SDF with light arms such as Ak-47 rifles and did not arm them with heavy weapons that could be used against a modern military equipped with tanks, artillery and warplanes like Turkey's.
But despite those efforts to appease Ankara, Turkey launched its invasion.
Senior members of the Trump administration have insisted that the US has not deserted the Syrian Kurds.
Secretary of Defense Mark Esper claimed Friday that the US is not abandoning its Kurdish allies who are now under attack from Turkey's military offensive into Syria, even as he made clear the US will not intervene in the fight.
A 'betrayal'
However, troops on the ground have described it as an abandonment and a "betrayal."
"It's pretty messed up what's happening out here," one US Special Forces soldier on the ground in Syria told CNN when news of the US withdrawal was announced.
"We want to offer support," the soldier said, adding "We do not want to leave them in this situation."
Several US military officials expressed disappointment that the Pentagon and State Department were not acting with a greater sense of urgency to protect the Kurds.
On Friday the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Mark Milley said he had told the SDF not to "overreact" to the Turkish operation.
Asked about the widely publicized criticism from US Special Operations Forces about the Syria policy, Secretary of the Army Ryan McCarthy said Monday that while such "candor" was "important," he said, "When national policy decisions are made, we salute and move out."
"I like candor. It's important to have that. Obviously, you don't want to have disobedience, but you, it's definitely, they have to have opinions. Everybody has opinions, you have a war of ideas, but ultimately that they, when national policy decisions are made, we salute and move out," he told reporters.
"They should be extremely proud of what they've done. and there are higher level strategic politics involved, but as far as what our soldiers have done, what our special forces have done, they've done an incredible job over there and they ought to be very, very proud of it," Gen. James McConville, the chief of staff of the Army, said Monday while appearing beside McCarthy.
In the absence of US assistance in the face of the Turkish attack the Kurds have sought protection from the Assad regime in Damascus and their Russian military backers, something Trump tweeted Monday that he was OK with.
Trump had earlier Monday cited uncorroborated reports that Kurdish officials had released some of the 10,000 ISIS prisoners being held by the SDF, a notion that was immediately rejected by a member of his own administration.
"Falsely claiming that the SDF Kurds are letting ISIS prisoners out of prison is wrong," a senior defense official said.
This story has been updated.
CNN's Barbara Starr contributed reporting.
---
Trump's Syria policy: US troops express anger at refusal to support K…
archived 15 Oct 2019 13:05:24 UTCUS troops express anger at Trump's Syria policy: 'We betrayed' the Kurds
A wide range of American military personnel and defense officials are expressing a deep sense of frustration and anger at the Trump administration's refusal to support Syrian Kurds facing a Turkish military assault, over half a dozen US military and defense officials have told CNN.
- Dołączono
- 22 Gru 2017
10am local time Damascus. Kurds are *allegedly making a counter push into the right flank of Turkish backed fighter. Looks like they don’t have contain on that town.
Edit: *Allegedly
Edit: *Allegedly
Ostatnio edytowane:
- Dołączono
- 8 Lis 2018
I think I know who our mystery BronyCon is:
Edit: Seriously how hard is it to understand? We never made any formal defense pact with the Kurds, but Turkey has been in NATO since 1952. Everyone thinks of SJWs when it comes to feels > reals but apparently that's also how neocon foreign policy works. America will declare war on Turkey and shower the Kurds with burgers and freedom fries while the whole train applauds because murrica is the angel of freedom and hope like it's some Hallmark channel movie.
Ostatnio edytowane:
- Dołączono
- 25 Maj 2013
I can see why warhawk fags are screeching since the USA signed all those treaties and upheld the Kuridsh Atlantic Treaty Organization for decades.
Oh wait no we didn't lol they're some randos that wanted to kill the same guys we did. Better repeat "betray" another seventy more times maybe it'll have been there if you wish really hard.
Oh wait no we didn't lol they're some randos that wanted to kill the same guys we did. Better repeat "betray" another seventy more times maybe it'll have been there if you wish really hard.
BR55
kiwifarms.net
- Dołączono
- 8 Maj 2017
I think one of the worse aspects of Americans is our raging boner for "Heroic Freedom Fighters", which the Kurds aren't by the way they're a bunch of commie terrorist ethnic nationalists.
Well that and the fact that some people are only weeping about the Kurds and calling for war like it's 2003 because Orange Man Bad.
- Dołączono
- 3 Sie 2019
The thing that nobody seems to understand is all of this was inevitable. The kurds were always going to collapse because the US was always going to leave them when the US public finally had enough of the eternal war, opening the way for their myriad enemies to charge in and skullfuck the idea of Kurdistan out of their brains.
They were ALWAYS expendable. Trump just accelerated their demise.
There is always another attack dog that will do US dirty work in exchange for US guns.
This is just another day in the Middle East, where allies and enemies are as everchanging as the wind.
They were ALWAYS expendable. Trump just accelerated their demise.
There is always another attack dog that will do US dirty work in exchange for US guns.
This is just another day in the Middle East, where allies and enemies are as everchanging as the wind.
- Dołączono
- 8 Lis 2018
Remember when the Mujahideen were "brave freedom fighters" against the USSR and inspired Red Dawn? I suppose pony boy would be seething that we abandoned our "allies" and tarnished our word or whatever.
- Dołączono
- 3 Sie 2019
Remember? My dad still has a VCR copy of Rambo 3 somewhere that tells me they were gud bois
⠠⠠⠅⠑⠋⠋⠁⠇⠎ ⠠⠠⠊⠎ ⠠⠠⠁ ⠠⠠⠋⠁⠛
Ulrich Wessel fiel, doch tausend neu erstehen!
True & Honest Fan
kiwifarms.net
- Dołączono
- 17 Mar 2019
US terrorist forces reported to be attempting to block the Syrian Arab Army from liberating terrorist-held cities in sovereign Syria to protect muh Kurds:
https://archive.is/7CFIm
- Dołączono
- 14 Cze 2018
Now we move from neoconservative sperging to anti-America sperging.
"US terrorist forces". Please.
Also:
>The Morning Star is unique, as a lone socialist voice in a sea of corporate media
Absolutely garbage source.
- Dołączono
- 4 Lis 2017
I'll do an effort post in few days here about the Kurds, but while they are commies, they aren't really terrorists.
Its more apt to compare the Kurds to the 1900s Irish in that both
- Dołączono
- 30 Kwi 2016
I know the bit of the border closest to the Red Sea is a river, but do you really think this counts as "the other side of the water"?
- Dołączono
- 26 Lut 2019
Alright, I just want to correct a misconception I have seen here:
Assad's SAA is not allied with the Kurdish SDF. The pinkish red color-scheme you see on Livemap is where the SDF have handed over military control to the SAA. Assad is not "gobbling up" the Kurdish territory by combat action.
Point made? Good.
_
General news:
As the ever helpful @It's HK-47 has told us. The US has put sanctions and tariffs on certain Turkish goods and individuals.
The Italians, Spanish and several other EU member states are putting an arms embargo on Turkey. Canada has also banned transfer of military equipment to Turkey.
The US is reportedly reviewing plans to remove B-61 Nuclear weapons out of Incirlik Air-Base, Turkey. (though I would not be in the least surprised if they have been gone for quite a while).
www.thedrive.com
US and Russia are maintaining "joint-control" over Syrian airspace.
The SDF and SAA have agreed to work together to expel Turkey and its allied fighters out of Syria.
Kurdish insurgent groups In Turkey claim to have targeted and killed several Turk soldiers.
It has been reported that Many of the small Kurdish villages have started getting garrisons in the north. Take that with a grain of salt.
_
Now for the Maps:
With action clusters:
SAA continues to move military forces to frontline staging areas. Kurd forces continue to act as a delaying force in many areas, until the heavier armed SAA can come into position.
Kurdish civilians are fleeing the frontlines and into the southwest territories as well as Al-Hasakah.
US forces are pulling out at the greatest reasonable speed.
_
Manbij: Heavy infantry fighting. SAA-SDF Artillery killed at least 2 Turks (Turk MoD confirmed). Looks like every flavor of Turk backed Jihadist and Rebel are fighting here.
with action clusters:
Artillery duels have been ongoing. Fighting I have read reports on fighting around Al' Arimah. Many villages along this front have seen fighting.
Turks seem hesitant to commit to fighting here. Content to allow their militia fighter to do the skirmishing. SAA-SDF look like they have a relatively strong defense here. Though whether they have the means to push the Turks out is another matter entirely.
_
Kobani Provence: Quiet, Both sides waiting for the US to leave before engaging in battle. SAA waiting on the outskirts of the province until US is evacuated. All per deconfliction deal made earlier.
With action clusters:
The fighting is expected to begin in earnest tonight and into tomorrow. Turks are apparently poised to strike on the border. Light infantry raids are reported
_
Tall Abyad/Akcakale, Suluk, and Ayn Isa front: Turkish backed forces are advancing on the southwestern front. Infantry raids on M4 Highway reported.
With action clusters:
Turkish heavy armor is reportedly crossing the border. Expect Turkish territorial control here to expand. SAA force presence still relatively limited. Kurds still acting as a delaying force.
Turks have a strong force here.
US had to deploy a large number of F-15s and Apache Gunships to disperse a large group of Turkish backed fighters who were threatening to attack a withdrawing US military convoy.
_
Ras al-Ayn, Tall Tamr, and M4 Axis: Heaviest fighting in Syria is currently here. Turk forces trying to hold the M4 while trying to cut off the 716 Hwy. Turks reportedly trying to hit SAA convoy with airstrikes (probably artillery, if anything, probably nothing, almost certainly false).
With action clusters:
Appears the SAA will be focusing on clearing the M4 International Highway, while the Kurds are committing most of their resources into holding Ras al-Ayn, and taking back the border crossing.
Multiple protracted engagement have been reported along the SAA convoy's route.
As for Ras al-Ayn proper: Heavy fighting into last night, Turk forces withdrew this morning, as they have started to do saturation artillery bombardment on the city.
Expect Syrian Army gains until more Turkish force reinforcements are brought up.
With action clusters:
As mentioned before, The Turk forces withdrawal seems to be temporary. Heavy artillery bombardment is raining on the city as of now.
Some Turkish equipment appears to be moving east. reasons vary.
Some reports indicated that the Turks want to encircle the city and conduct a more conventional siege. I doubt it.
Some reports say that the Turks want to expand and solidify their eastern flank. Plausible.
Still other say that the Turks want to be able to storm the city with direct fire support from both sides when this bombardment period ends. Also Plausible.
Make of all that what you will.
Either way, Turk forces are strong, but the Kurds are holding stubbornly.
_____
Most other regions are quiet. Though I heard reports that some SAA forces have been able to advance forward in the south of Idlib province. I can't confirm that work shit though.
Bottom line:
Turks and Syrians are now starting to kill each other. Perhaps we ought to start spinning up a new thread soon, eh?
That's all for now, might be back later tonight with more. We'll see.
Assad's SAA is not allied with the Kurdish SDF. The pinkish red color-scheme you see on Livemap is where the SDF have handed over military control to the SAA. Assad is not "gobbling up" the Kurdish territory by combat action.
Point made? Good.
_
General news:
As the ever helpful @It's HK-47 has told us. The US has put sanctions and tariffs on certain Turkish goods and individuals.
The Italians, Spanish and several other EU member states are putting an arms embargo on Turkey. Canada has also banned transfer of military equipment to Turkey.
The US is reportedly reviewing plans to remove B-61 Nuclear weapons out of Incirlik Air-Base, Turkey. (though I would not be in the least surprised if they have been gone for quite a while).
U.S. Reviewing Options For Pulling Nuclear Bombs Out Of Turkey, Here's How They Might Do It
The rapidly evolving crisis in Syria may prompt the U.S. to finally remove its nuclear stockpile from Turkey, a move that some say is long overdue.
www.thedrive.com
US and Russia are maintaining "joint-control" over Syrian airspace.
The SDF and SAA have agreed to work together to expel Turkey and its allied fighters out of Syria.
Kurdish insurgent groups In Turkey claim to have targeted and killed several Turk soldiers.
It has been reported that Many of the small Kurdish villages have started getting garrisons in the north. Take that with a grain of salt.
_
Now for the Maps:
With action clusters:
SAA continues to move military forces to frontline staging areas. Kurd forces continue to act as a delaying force in many areas, until the heavier armed SAA can come into position.
Kurdish civilians are fleeing the frontlines and into the southwest territories as well as Al-Hasakah.
US forces are pulling out at the greatest reasonable speed.
_
Manbij: Heavy infantry fighting. SAA-SDF Artillery killed at least 2 Turks (Turk MoD confirmed). Looks like every flavor of Turk backed Jihadist and Rebel are fighting here.
with action clusters:
Artillery duels have been ongoing. Fighting I have read reports on fighting around Al' Arimah. Many villages along this front have seen fighting.
Turks seem hesitant to commit to fighting here. Content to allow their militia fighter to do the skirmishing. SAA-SDF look like they have a relatively strong defense here. Though whether they have the means to push the Turks out is another matter entirely.
_
Kobani Provence: Quiet, Both sides waiting for the US to leave before engaging in battle. SAA waiting on the outskirts of the province until US is evacuated. All per deconfliction deal made earlier.
With action clusters:
The fighting is expected to begin in earnest tonight and into tomorrow. Turks are apparently poised to strike on the border. Light infantry raids are reported
_
Tall Abyad/Akcakale, Suluk, and Ayn Isa front: Turkish backed forces are advancing on the southwestern front. Infantry raids on M4 Highway reported.
With action clusters:
Turkish heavy armor is reportedly crossing the border. Expect Turkish territorial control here to expand. SAA force presence still relatively limited. Kurds still acting as a delaying force.
Turks have a strong force here.
US had to deploy a large number of F-15s and Apache Gunships to disperse a large group of Turkish backed fighters who were threatening to attack a withdrawing US military convoy.
_
Ras al-Ayn, Tall Tamr, and M4 Axis: Heaviest fighting in Syria is currently here. Turk forces trying to hold the M4 while trying to cut off the 716 Hwy. Turks reportedly trying to hit SAA convoy with airstrikes (probably artillery, if anything, probably nothing, almost certainly false).
With action clusters:
Appears the SAA will be focusing on clearing the M4 International Highway, while the Kurds are committing most of their resources into holding Ras al-Ayn, and taking back the border crossing.
Multiple protracted engagement have been reported along the SAA convoy's route.
As for Ras al-Ayn proper: Heavy fighting into last night, Turk forces withdrew this morning, as they have started to do saturation artillery bombardment on the city.
Expect Syrian Army gains until more Turkish force reinforcements are brought up.
With action clusters:
As mentioned before, The Turk forces withdrawal seems to be temporary. Heavy artillery bombardment is raining on the city as of now.
Some Turkish equipment appears to be moving east. reasons vary.
Some reports indicated that the Turks want to encircle the city and conduct a more conventional siege. I doubt it.
Some reports say that the Turks want to expand and solidify their eastern flank. Plausible.
Still other say that the Turks want to be able to storm the city with direct fire support from both sides when this bombardment period ends. Also Plausible.
Make of all that what you will.
Either way, Turk forces are strong, but the Kurds are holding stubbornly.
_____
Most other regions are quiet. Though I heard reports that some SAA forces have been able to advance forward in the south of Idlib province. I can't confirm that work shit though.
Bottom line:
Turks and Syrians are now starting to kill each other. Perhaps we ought to start spinning up a new thread soon, eh?
That's all for now, might be back later tonight with more. We'll see.