Plummeting Birthrates Watch Thread - The horrifying implications of living in a Children of Men situation.

[Audit]

There will need to be some wealth redistribution if developed nations want the needle to budge on this. Forcing corporations to pay higher wages to US workers would be one way. Microsofts market cap is 2.85 trillion, thats a lot of kids who can become taxpaying adults in 18 years if they paid entry level workers more while they are still young and fertile.

The solution is literally just to ban immigration and labor offshoring. Microsoft and co. are mass importing replacement populations and have absolutely no motivation to pay US workers a dime more.

 

[The Gay Oboma Creature]

The solution is literally just to ban immigration and labor offshoring. Microsoft and co. are mass importing replacement populations and have absolutely no motivation to pay US workers a dime more.

Migrants aren't actually cheaper. Aside from their cost to the government in terms of jail, infrastructure, welfare, and general social decay (which would be enough to pay any company currently using migrant workers more than enough to hire natives instead), their salaries are only a bit below the standard.

What the jeets get hired for, other than nepotism, is an end run around affirmative action. Among Americans, the only codefags you can find, aside from a tiny handful of American Asians, are White. Even if you hire every black guy and Mexican who can fizzbuzz, your company will still be 70 percent White, meaning every Democrat and every journo in the country will be calling for your head 24/7. With a workforce that's 95% jeet instead, the Dems don't complain, nor does the press, because AA isn't about helping the blacks, it's about hurting the Whites, so even if not a single African American can get a job in the tech industry, they're still happy about the outcome. Accordingly, companies that don't want to be harassed endlessly just take the easy way out, forego some competence, and hire as many H1-Bs as they can without immediately collapsing due to subcontinental ineptitude.

All of this is to say that the problem requires regime change because the current regime is actively hostile to the idea of White people having families.

 

[Myrtle the Turtle]

The solution is literally just to ban immigration and labor offshoring. Microsoft and co. are mass importing replacement populations and have absolutely no motivation to pay US workers a dime more.

Unfortunately we have a boomer in office and the republican front runner is married to a jeeta. We have a higher chance of getting a democratic socialist presidential candidate than we do of anyone banning offshoring to yeet the jeets.

 

[The Gay Oboma Creature]

Unfortunately we have a boomer in office and the republican front runner is married to a jeeta. We have a higher chance of getting a democratic socialist presidential candidate than we do of anyone banning offshoring to yeet the jeets.

It's not quite so bad as you say. The jeets should be completely expelled from the civilized world, of course, but the demand has been dropping steadily since Trump got back in, about as fast as it rose under Biden.

Vance has made some poor life choices, but he has gradually shifted away from libertarianism and towards a more right-wing system of beliefs. I imagine there's some internal conflict there, but still.

 

[BubbaRobot887]

The one good thing about this is that it means since we are all slave fewer slaves are being born to support the masters and soon every government and economic system will collapse. Once that happens and we have a rebirth of freedom because all the elites from both the government and businesses are gone and people are forced to become free land owning farmers again I think birth rates will start to go up but it will take a couple of hundred years.

There is no reason for a slave to have children as they are just more property for their masters so as the master consolidate power birth rates will continue to fall, but at some point we will cross the line and the pyramid will not have enough people at the bottom to keep it going, everything will fall apart and we will return to a system where every man is free and living off his own land and producing the food he eats with no government or corporations existing to get in the way, then people will start reproducing again.

The key after that is to reject all forms of government and money and only use a barter system so the human race never faces the hell we are living in today again.

 

[SOLDIER OF WALES]

tl;dr: There actually are a bunch of cute unclaimed virgins around, there's just no real way to meet them because they are rightly terrified of the rising tide of biotrash surrounding their houses.

this is the worst part about everything. i've managed to rise above the tide and i still can't get my cute autistic gf...

Life is suffering...

 

[Chicha Drinker]

There is no reason for a slave to have children as they are just more property for their masters so as the master consolidate power birth rates will continue to fall, but at some point we will cross the line and the pyramid will not have enough people at the bottom to keep it going, everything will fall apart and we will return to a system where ever man in free and living off his own land and producing the food he eats with no government or corporations existing to get in the way, then people will start reproducing again.

Why do you think theyve been fighting so hard for ai and automation for years now? Read the Georgia Guidestones (back when they existed)

 

[BubbaRobot887]

Why do you think theyve been fighting so hard for ai and automation for years now? Read the Georgia Guidestones (back when they existed)

Here is the problem with that, the elites are too lazy and stupid to program the AIs themselves so the moment the AIs encounter a problem they were not trained to deal with the system will collapse.

This is why we must flood the internet with useless and wrong information and reddit should be our main target since they use that site above all others to train the AIs, that way the AI will be useless.

 

[Squishie PP]

The one good thing about this is that it means since we are all slave fewer slaves are being born to support the masters and soon every government and economic system will collapse. Once that happens and we have a rebirth of freedom because all the elites from both the government and businesses are gone and people are forced to become free land owning farmers again I think birth rates will start to go up but it will take a couple of hundred years.

There is no reason for a slave to have children as they are just more property for their masters so as the master consolidate power birth rates will continue to fall, but at some point we will cross the line and the pyramid will not have enough people at the bottom to keep it going, everything will fall apart and we will return to a system where every man is free and living off his own land and producing the food he eats with no government or corporations existing to get in the way, then people will start reproducing again.

The key after that is to reject all forms of government and money and only use a barter system so the human race never faces the hell we are living in today again.

Eventually they will just have brain-on-chip machines hyper-tailored for specific tasks.
This is already in development as we speak.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRV8fSw6HaE

 

[BubbaRobot887]

Eventually they will just have brain-on-chip machines hyper-tailored for specific tasks.
This is already in development as we speak.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRV8fSw6HaE

And they will fail, it is physically impossible to make a computer that has the problem solving capabilities of a human mind.

They are already finding that for even the lowest level tasks that it takes way to much energy and water to replace a handful of humans, to do so on a global scale is impossible.

Then even if they could do it they run into the problem that they get the wealth to fund it from taxing and selling products to us, once we are all unemployed the system that supports the AI falls apart.

Replacing human workers with AI is the pipe dream of people with more money than braincells like Elon Musk, it can't work long term.

 

[The Gay Oboma Creature]

it is physically impossible to make a computer that has the problem solving capabilities of a human mind.

While I can certainly see the various aspects of the competence crisis coming to term before AI gets good enough to be a viable replacement for human workers, this is a claim that needs strong evidence.

In five years, we've gone from "LLMs can occasionally write a coherent sentence" to "Math PhDs from MIT are using LLMs to oneshot longstanding unsolved problems". There are smart people who argue that the current paradigm can't improve indefinitely, but we're already at the point where it's more useful than the modal Indian.

They are already finding that for even the lowest level tasks that it takes way to much energy and water to replace a handful of humans, to do so on a global scale is impossible.

It doesn't take any water, data centers sucking up lakes like the villain in an old cartoon is slop for redditors and podcast retards. As for electricity, that can be solved just by not going full retard on e.g. nuclear power. With the money saved by deporting every migrant in the country, we could triple the number of data centers and still pay everyone's electricity bill for free.

Then even if they could do it they run into the problem that they get the wealth to fund it from taxing and selling products to us, once we are all unemployed the system that supports the AI falls apart.

That isn't how economics works. Money doesn't come from selling products to consumers. Money represents productivity. The idea that the economic engine of the nation involves giving money to welfare recipients so they can buy hot chips and cell phones is (understandably) popular among certain segments of society, but we would actually be able to build more cool stuff if those welfare recipients were euthanized and the resources used to sustain them were funneled into anything else.

 

[The Ugly One]

Normally I would agree with you, but if that were true, zoomers would be having more kids right now. We don't live in an agrarian-centric society anymore where more kids=more free labor for profit.

Within zoomers, poorer demos have higher birth rates than richer demos.

There will need to be some wealth redistribution if developed nations want the needle to budge on this. Forcing corporations to pay higher wages to US workers would be one way. Microsofts market cap is 2.85 trillion, thats a lot of income to support kids who can become taxpaying adults in 18 years if they paid entry level workers more while they are still young and fertile.

Since wealth distribution doesn't cause birth rates to fall, changing it won't cause it to rise. We all know what decreases birth rates, the single most influential factor is how many years women spend in school. This means there is one solution. It's like you've constantly got indigestion from eating too much hot sauce, but the one thing you refuse to do is cut back on the hot sauce, so you're searching for a miracle cure, none of which work.

The solution is unpalatable, but there is no other solution. Women need to not be spending their early 20s in school. They need to not be all funneled into job training programs. Women have babies when they economically depend on men directly, rather than indirectly, mediated through the state. The state taking even more money from men and handing to women will make it worse.

 

[Rootless Cosmopolitan]

Within zoomers, poorer demos have higher birth rates than richer demos.



Since wealth distribution doesn't cause birth rates to fall, changing it won't cause it to rise. We all know what decreases birth rates, the single most influential factor is how many years women spend in school. This means there is one solution. It's like you've constantly got indigestion from eating too much hot sauce, but the one thing you refuse to do is cut back on the hot sauce, so you're searching for a miracle cure, none of which work.

The solution is unpalatable, but there is no other solution. Women need to not be spending their early 20s in school. They need to not be all funneled into job training programs. Women have babies when they economically depend on men directly, rather than indirectly, mediated through the state. The state taking even more money from men and handing to women will make it worse.

Is there any place that has modernized/developed economically where women did NOT start spending more time in school?

I’m not arguing that there isn’t a correlation, I just think the true cause is something else about modern society causing both high levels of education in women and fertility declines. Years of education for women in Latin America already plateaued long before their epic fertility dive, for example.

If this is the case, restricting women from school in a developed economy won’t do much for fertility rates.

if the “solution” is reverting to a disgusting undeveloped shithole so that we spawn more, that’s not really a solution at all. We don’t simply want more babies. We want more babies while preserving our first world societies.

Otherwise, importing lots of impoverished third worlders would be satisfactory. It’s not.

 

[The Gay Oboma Creature]

We all know what decreases birth rates, the single most influential factor is how many years women spend in school. This means there is one solution. It's like you've constantly got indigestion from eating too much hot sauce, but the one thing you refuse to do is cut back on the hot sauce, so you're searching for a miracle cure, none of which work.

That's ultimately it. You don't need to ban it, but you do need to get rid of the legal and political incentives behind "Jew Daycare" jobs. Ditch the gender equity laws and society sorts itself out pretty quick. Women pair up normally instead of believing that their natural match is Christian Grey, they have kids, and they stop supporting evil policies on every front.

 

[The Ugly One]

Is there any place that has modernized/developed economically where women did NOT start spending more time in school?

The USA immediately after WW2.

State subsidized education, state gender quotas, and state equality laws are policy choices. There is nothing "organic" about companies being required to hire and overpay women.

Years of education for women in Latin America already plateaued long before their epic fertility dive, for example.

Nope. Mexican Women only began to outnumber Mexican men in graduate school in 2016.


The relationship is undeniable.


If you want women to stop having children, push them into masculine social roles. Babies simply get in the way of finishing your MBA or getting that next promotion. "How do we have women live masculine lives, but also have babies?" is an unsolvable problem. It's overconstrained.

 

[Rootless Cosmopolitan]

The USA immediately after WW2.

State subsidized education, state gender quotas, and state equality laws are policy choices. There is nothing "organic" about companies being required to hire and overpay women.


Nope. Mexican Women only began to outnumber Mexican men in graduate school in 2016.
Wyświetl załącznik 9230684

The relationship is undeniable.
Wyświetl załącznik 9230688Wyświetl załącznik 9230689

If you want women to stop having children, push them into masculine social roles. Babies simply get in the way of finishing your MBA or getting that next promotion. "How do we have women live masculine lives, but also have babies?" is an unsolvable problem. It's overconstrained.

This graph shows the opposite of what you’re claiming



Right now (and since 1990), women with more than a HS education are having more babies than women without a HS education.

And yeah you cited Mexico graduate school rates, but educational attainment for overall women in Latin America peaked/plateaued around 2010 and the birth only really cratered in the last 5-10 years. It maps more cleanly to cell phone/internet adoption than to women’s education.

Conversely, Israeli women have increased their educational attainment, but birth rates have hovered around 3 since the 1970s.

Anyway, Afghanistan did your experiment in restricting women’s education. Yet their fertility has continued to decline.

Afghanistan fertility rate for 2026 is 3.52, a 3.03% decline since 2025​

• Afghanistan fertility rate for 2025 was 3.63, a 2.94% decline from 2024.
• Afghanistan fertility rate for 2024 was 3.74, a 2.86% decline from 2023.
• Afghanistan fertility rate for 2023 was 3.85, a 3.53% decline from 2022.

You guys just keep coming in here with the same tired ideological arguments and are blind to how bizarre and pernicious this problem actually is.

I would argue that most western countries have been egalitarian for quite a while now, long before fertility nose dived. And plenty of places (Iran!! Saudi!!) are nosediving despite not being egalitarian at all.

Sure, the shitholes like Haiti or Somalia aren’t egalitarian, but they never were and probably never will be because they are shitholes. And the solution can’t be “become more like Somalia” because fuck that, I’d rather go extinct.

 

[Paper Machete]

It's probably not so much school itself as it is the domino effect of getting into debt, starting a career and not wanting to risk not getting further in it by having outside responsibilities, work for a lot of fields tends to be in high cost of living areas so everything is expensive, falling into the trap of thinking men value similar things in a partner as a woman does so surely having a nice job will be a major factor in getting a man.......nobody who wants kids is going after post 30 project managers oh no.

It's a similar thing for some of the guys, get on the debt treadmill through school and couple with a woman also on the debt treadmill, housing is expensive and both of them have already declined in fertility to the point they might need to go into more debt to try and have kids.

Also, there is legit anti motherhood attitudes masquerading as advice out there.

Education can be a good thing but chasing credentialism to the point of financial ruin is not.

 

[Unredacted TND]

Percent of Black Births to Foreign-Born Mothers:

ME: 88.32%
SD: 81.34%
VT: 76.19%
MA: 68.02%
ID: 67.96%
MN: 65.71%
NH: 64.89%
UT: 57.85%
WA: 54.85%
IA: 54.63%
OR: 51.97%
RI: 49.76%
CO: 46.37%
NE: 44.35%
ND: 43.72%
CT: 39.80%
MT: 37.50%
NJ: 35.24%
NM: 33.91%
KY: 32.52%
AK: 31.94%
AZ: 31.02%
FL: 30.02%
IN: 29.81%
MD: 28.13%
NY: 26.07%
OH: 25.82%
KS: 22.73%
DE: 21.47%
PA: 20.93%
WV: 20.45%
HI: 19.32%
TX: 18.16%
VA: 17.50%
CA: 15.28%
WI: 13.59%
MO: 13.06%
IL: 12.98%
NV: 12.33%
GA: 11.98%
DC: 10.95%
NC: 10.21%
TN: 9.89%
OK: 9.00%
MI: 7.78%
AL: 5.54%
SC: 4.60%
AR: 3.65%
LA: 2.08%
MS: 1.06%

The future of Black America is Somalis, Haitians, Congolese, Nigerians, and other assorted African groups.

To be fair, there are literally no blacks in Maine other than Somalis.

 

[Chicha Drinker]

If you want women to stop having children, push them into masculine social roles. Babies simply get in the way of finishing your MBA or getting that next promotion. "How do we have women live masculine lives, but also have babies?" is an unsolvable problem. It's overconstrained.

Tfw my friend has been waiting to start a family for nearly 5 years now with his wife because she has put her entire self worth into getting into this super niche doctorate program and refuses to do anything before then.

Within zoomers, poorer demos have higher birth rates than richer demos.

This also hits home, i have 1 friend who makes shit money as a teacher and his wife works part time and they have already 2 kids before 30 and want more, on the other hand i have several friends who are very well off but "if and um" about having kids (They dont want to stop chasing dopamine, millenial/zoomer manchildren basically).

Likely its a mix of everything, women's rights, education, celebrated immaturity in culture and social media, etc all together in a perfect storm

 

[The Gay Oboma Creature]

Conversely, Israeli women have increased their educational attainment, but birth rates have hovered around 3 since the 1970s.

Israel is unique in this. Depending on your views, it's either because Haredim are sufficiently 'ingroup-y' that ordinary Israelis see them having kids and are socially influenced to have more kids of their own, or it's because they're the one people on earth not subconsciously burdened by the knowledge that they live under an occupation government that hates them.

I, personally, say mostly column A, but column B has some strong arguments. In any case, to replicate their conditions, you would need the mormons to start having six kids each again, and then you would need to give them a draft exemption and a state subsidy, and scatter them over the continent to peer-pressure normies into reproducing. A lot harder than repealing the CRA.

Anyway, Afghanistan did your experiment in restricting women’s education. Yet their fertility has continued to decline.

I think there's a difference between going from 5 to 3 and going from 3 to 1. Better medical care and lower infant mortality will naturally move you away from super-high numbers without Haredi-level efforts to prevent this (You would need to build an entire religion around giving men neetbux and a submissive tradwife who also goes out and earns money for them, I am not joking, this is actually what they do, Israel's tech sector is full of Haredi women earning money for their husbands).

A normal, healthy culture isn't going to sit at seven kids each forever under modern conditions,

---

Tfw my friend has been waiting to start a family for nearly 5 years now with his wife because she has put her entire self worth into getting into this super niche doctorate program and refuses to do anything before then.

This hits close to home. Is it a prestige thing? She could be subtly influenced by the fact that childlessness and waiting for kids are a gauche, striver thing, and actual elites don't do that. Children (that aren't obese, iPad-raised hellions) are the ultimate status symbol nowadays.

If it's about genuine passion for the field, like she's one of the rare female autists that sincerely loves organic chem, she should know that a PhD is the most free time you're ever going to have. You spend your mental energy on research, and your physical energy goes into whatever you need to get done in your life besides that. When you're too burned out to write one more page of your dissertation, you play with your kid, you go to the gym, you fix that thing in the garage you meant to fix a week ago, instead of staring at nothing and hating yourself.