Ukrainian Defensive War against the Russian Invasion - Mark IV: The Partitioning of Discussion

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@Ghostse You mentioned Pantsirs

If anyone is wondering why I been harping on extended range autocannons and larger... Once the drone, missile, kamikaze and etc. gets within a certain range, close enough ain't good enough for the defender. While for the attacker close enough is good enough for whatever the drone, missile, kamikaze and etc. falls and explodes on if they get hit.

edit: Yes I'm retarded for not knowing how to do Twitter links.
 
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Oh no, consequences! And no more vacations or summer camps lol.
"It's so unfair, why is this happennniiiing!!"
:story:

Her comment about truck drivers refusing to work confirms other reports too. Sitting at home, getting drunk & complaining is probably the preferable option to waiting for hours (a classic Russian pastime) in fuel lines, being extorted for it, and possibly getting blown up afterwards.

And speaking of...
Screenshot_20260624-210305.png
I'd like to see that drone video lol.
 
Oh no, consequences! And no more vacations or summer camps lol.
"It's so unfair, why is this happennniiiing!!"
:story:
RDT_20260624_220927.mp4
Her comment about truck drivers refusing to work confirms other reports too. Sitting at home, getting drunk & complaining is probably the preferable option to waiting for hours (a classic Russian pastime) in fuel lines, being extorted for it, and possibly getting blown up afterwards.

And speaking of...
Wyświetl załącznik 9189709
I'd like to see that drone video lol.
Always a good day when propagandist dies
 
Fuel shortages in Russia are so widespread we now need a map to keep up with them:
Wyświetl załącznik 9188676
I want to point out that despite the Strait of Homoz being closed for two months, and despite EU "green policies" fucking thier energy sector, and despite being to forced at gunpoint to at long last shut off a decent percentage amount of Russian Oil imports.....
OPEC MEMBER RUSSIA IS RUNNING OUT OF GAS BEFORE FUCKING EUROPE DID

AHAHAHAHAHAH this is like Zimbabwe when it went from the regions top food exporter to an importer after they chased off whitey.

Also, remember what I said about War Economies: they don't slow, they seize up and explode.

Oh no, consequences! And no more vacations or summer camps lol.
"It's so unfair, why is this happennniiiing!!"
:story:
poster.avif
2:48
Her comment about truck drivers refusing to work confirms other reports too. Sitting at home, getting drunk & complaining is probably the preferable option to waiting for hours (a classic Russian pastime) in fuel lines, being extorted for it, and possibly getting blown up afterwards
This fucking bitch. Holy fucking shit I hope she gets maimed.
Waaaaaaah the war I called for and support is causing me inconvencies! waaaaaaah

"Civilians are being subjected to drone strikes and I can't sleep" - Oh gee you mean what Ukrainian civilians have had to put up with LONGER THAN THE ENTIRETY OF WWI?!
"My school! my summer camps" Russia has bombed multiple children's hospital, one during the day.
"Truckers refuse to die in the New Territories!" - maybe give them back to the country you stole them from.
"We can't do anything!" - Wrong bitch. Russia, specifically Putin, could end this war at any point, unilaterally. "Russia is withdrawing all forces to 1991 borders" and all this shit immediately stops.

What a wonderful rant. But as usual, even though he recognizes that Russia is ruled by the regime of kleptocrats who sold out USSR's legacy for personal benefit and continues to rob Russian people, he doesn't question legitimacy of the war they started. He's only upset because they're getting their shit pushed in, because his wet fantasies about Russia's military might ended up being a nightmare, and that they don't get to bully Ukrainians uncontested.
Please, more of this
Wyświetl załącznik 9188377

He looks a lot like The Quartering btw, don't know what to make of it.
Yeah that's the great part of these rants that makes laughing at these ziggers good clean fun: they aren't lamenting the war, only that they are getting their shit pushed in and consequences have finally arrived.

This is only the beginning. I expect more zigger meltdowns as the situation deteriorates further. Lmao It can only get worse for them from here.
That's what we're here for.

That was quite a bold strategy and it does appear to have paid off.
Z man must have some solid intel.
tl;dr: Probably at Putin's direction. If Belarus is deemed to be involved in the war, it will be causus belli for other former SSRs to throw in with Ukraine.

I initially waved off Ukraine's new wave of attacks being CIA-supported, launched now because Iran looks largely wrapped up (or at least all the trapped oil tankers getting free), as a combination of reward for Ukraine for not destroying Russia's oil industry until Hormuz was taken care of and revenge on Russia for helping Iran. But holy fuck, the speed at which Ukraine's blitz has been fucking Russia makes me really start to considering if there's something to do it and Bro really does need to be just trusted.

Side musing, I wonder how much of is the AGM-188 being able to act as a saturation target for AAD. It only carries 99kg of explosives, but given NATO weapons are usually capable of actually hitting their targets, that is enough to ruin most targets' day. But more importantly russian AAD operators likely aren't familiar with these "jet powered Mk82s" yet and are probbaly wasting interceptors on them.

"Light" FPV drone strikes on vehicles carrying Russian Armed Forces personnel in the Donetsk region
Next Modern Warfare game is going to be fucking LIT.

Russian position being hit by thermite:
RDT_20260623_202244.mp4
Yep, that's pretty terrifying.
Good.
Yes. Pour some water on that thermite. That will help.

RDT_20260624_152036891896972142502838.jpg RDT_20260624_1520472401634482798393719.jpg
Ngl that thing is pretty badass.
:semperfidelis:
IT BELONGS IN A MUSEUM

*in cartoony high-pitched voice* "FUCKING HOHOLS!"
:lol:
 
Ostatnio edytowane:
I want to point out that despite the Strait of Homoz being closed for two months, and despite EU "green policies" fucking thier energy sector, and despite being to forced at gunpoint to at long last shut off a decent percentage amount of Russian Oil imports.....
OPEC MEMBER RUSSIA IS RUNNING OUT OF GAS BEFORE FUCKING EUROPE DID

AHAHAHAHAHAH this is like Zimbabwe when it went from the regions top food exporter to an importer after they chased off whitey.

Also, remember what I said about War Economies: they don't slow, they seize up and explode.
Those Westoid sanctions that vatniggers laughed at scooped out what little foundations Russia's economy had. Russia's ability to manufacture many of the parts and whole pieces of equipment for its oil refineries, tank farms, and pipelines was weak pre-war. It got lots of that stuff from Europe and Murica, and obviously hasn't been able to for years now. Russia tried replacing that supply with temu chinesium, results were exactly as you'd expect. Shit was so bad quality, from subpar materials to design flaws to manufacturing defects, even Russians won't try to use it to fix or replace their blown up stuff anymore
 
The relevant bit is the part where he cites Putin on the issue of demographics and speculates that it could've been one of the reasons for the invasion of Ukraine, to simply add them to Russian population. Which I suppose is better than importing Infinite Indians, but that only makes sense when you imagine that a quick and relatively bloodless takeover is possible, as Putin probably did (didn't quite pan out that way).
 
Fresh wonk:
Ukraine may be trying to convince Russia it is getting ready to invade Crimea to get Russia to shift forces. It is not clear if this is to just get relief in Donetsk or they are planning a big funny to hit somewhere else.

This is hard to judge because Crimea would be a strategic nightmare for Ukraine to hold, but Ukraine royally fucked the 2023 counter offensive for optics so it wouldn't be with precident for them not think strategically but about PR to their detriment.

Alternative wonks include:
Ukraine might be getting ready for a peace deal posturing
Given how Iran/ISR and India/Pakistan treaties went down, it is expected any lasting ceasefire for negotiations with Ukraine and Russia would include two dates the deal goes into place. One would be a halt of major offensives, and the second would an cessation of all hostilities. That is, on the 1st you are not suppsed to take any cities or towns you don't already have, but you have until the 15th to finalize your ceasefire positioning.
Crimea has been virtually absent from negotiations because its largely considered a settled issue.
Ukraine may be preparing to change that by militarily depleting Crimea and then before the major operations freeze, thunder run into Crimea to capture a reasonable chunk. The major offense freeze would likely prevent Russia from being able to respond in any meaningful way in time, meaning Ukraine would only need to weather local Russian responses. Ability to put HIMARS in range of Kersch bridge - not just ATACMS - would allow Ukraine to effectively spam the bridge until Russian AAD is exhausted and the bridge can be ACK'ed, shutting down reinforce/resupply.

Those Westoid sanctions that vatniggers laughed at scooped out what little foundations Russia's economy had. Russia's ability to manufacture many of the parts and whole pieces of equipment for its oil refineries, tank farms, and pipelines was weak pre-war. It got lots of that stuff from Europe and Murica, and obviously hasn't been able to for years now. Russia tried replacing that supply with temu chinesium, results were exactly as you'd expect. Shit was so bad quality, from subpar materials to design flaws to manufacturing defects, even Russians won't try to use it to fix or replace their blown up stuff anymore

This is a joyous occassion so I will avoid Yuroposting.
I will only say: Sanctions started out as a complete joke, and only since the last year of Biden's term did they get any real bite put on them. (insert "it takes time to shift energy aquistion at nation-state levels") and it was doubtful at the start if the sanctions would be adhered to for the long haul. They generally have, and while I think temporary gasoline disruptions.

I'm also going to say that the effect of Western sanctions would not be felt as accutely as it is now without Ukraine drone-fucking Russia's refineries for the past two years.

Additonally while its absolutely hilarious Russians are suffering gas shortages and blackouts, I don't think this latest humiliation is a sign of the impending implosion I go on about. Its not a sign of HEALTH lets be clear, but this is not showing a flaw in Russia's economy or supply chain that hasn't happened before. Russia has had border provinces implement rationing or suspended sales/deliveries due to bigger acks from Ukraine before, and I expect they absorb this one as well and in no longer than TWO MORE WEEKS it'l be back to normal for anywhere that isn't Crimea.


The relevant bit is the part where he cites Putin on the issue of demographics and speculates that it could've been one of the reasons for the invasion of Ukraine, to simply add them to Russian population. Which I suppose is better than importing Infinite Indians, but that only makes sense when you imagine that a quick and relatively bloodless takeover is possible, as Putin probably did (didn't quite pan out that way).
https://youtube.com/watch?v=1ieqxNLX5v4
I don't think that makes sense.
Remember the direct cause of Putin fucking around in Ukraine was his puppet YankitySax trying to make mineral deals with the EU and being dick slapped by Putin when the oligarchs and russian economy couldn't get cheap ores & ingots anymore. This pissed off the EU, which threatened to pull economic carve outs from Ukraine, which threatened the high-paying EU job workers, which lead to Maidan.

Putin just wanted Ukaine's mineral wealth, to reform the USSR, and if his new territories came with a slave labor population to exploit that was just a bonus.
 
Ukraine might be getting ready for a peace deal posturing
Given how Iran/ISR and India/Pakistan treaties went down, it is expected any lasting ceasefire for negotiations with Ukraine and Russia would include two dates the deal goes into place. One would be a halt of major offensives, and the second would an cessation of all hostilities. That is, on the 1st you are not suppsed to take any cities or towns you don't already have, but you have until the 15th to finalize your ceasefire positioning
I have a feeling Ukraine will try for peace after the Iran deal is settled. The US is far too distracted to get into the Ukraine peace process again until after the midterms at least. My speculation is they are softening up Russia for peace talks before another hard winter sets in.

Putin's legacy hinges on Crimea. Its a big trophy he's won for 10+ years. Russia isn't giving it up, and I don't see how Ukraine can take it from a logistics pov since Russia can do the same attacks on Ukraine, leave their troops stranded and open for slaughter. At most they can stop the Russian offensive and cut off Crimea from gas which seems to working well enough. Ukraine lacks manpower to retake Crimea and will focus on retaking inland territory.
Putin just wanted Ukaine's mineral wealth, to reform the USSR, and if his new territories came with a slave labor population to exploit that was just a bonus.
Ukraine also came with the old Soviet defense industry infrastructure which, if taken quickly, could have helped Russias war machine for other Eastern European countries. That dream is dead now.
 
But more importantly russian AAD operators likely aren't familiar with these "jet powered Mk82s" yet and are probbaly wasting interceptors on them.

Speaking of which, I heard that Russia has found some sort of jet turbine to strap to Geran drones, which could be an issue for the currently-quite-successful machine gun and interceptor drone based AA?
 
I don't think that makes sense.
Remember the direct cause of Putin fucking around in Ukraine was his puppet YankitySax trying to make mineral deals with the EU and being dick slapped by Putin when the oligarchs and russian economy couldn't get cheap ores & ingots anymore. This pissed off the EU, which threatened to pull economic carve outs from Ukraine, which threatened the high-paying EU job workers, which lead to Maidan.

Putin just wanted Ukaine's mineral wealth, to reform the USSR, and if his new territories came with a slave labor population to exploit that was just a bonus.
Well, I was going to mention that it's hardly the only reason or even the main one, but I assumed that much was obvious
Speaking of which, I heard that Russia has found some sort of jet turbine to strap to Geran drones, which could be an issue for the currently-quite-successful machine gun and interceptor drone based AA?
They could be referring to flaming buttholes of the zigger milbloggers
 
utin's legacy hinges on Crimea. Its a big trophy he's won for 10+ years. Russia isn't giving it up, and I don't see how Ukraine can take it from a logistics pov since Russia can do the same attacks on Ukraine, leave their troops stranded and open for slaughter. At most they can stop the Russian offensive and cut off Crimea from gas which seems to working well enough. Ukraine lacks manpower to retake Crimea and will focus on retaking inland territory.
Conversely, given Ukraine is shitting all over the Russian capital virtually unopposed right now, they may not need to. Putin doesn't want to give up Crimea but given that's where this whole stupid thing started back in 2014, there is no greater humiliation than to kick that bald bastard's imperialist objectives right back to square one.

After all, all Ukraine wants is Russia to GTFO of the country, which legally includes Crimea, and they're really in the position of power that's only strengthening by the day. I would imagine the rest of the world would back this because it's known Russia pretty much supplied the missile system that killed that plane full of dutch doctors and tried to bury the evidence, to which Russia suffered no major reprecussions.
 
Do Muskovites really regard themselves as distinct from other Russians, is this a common sentiment?
I remember I used to have a co-worker that moved in from Russia. He was actually a pretty nice dude, as far as Russians go. He was born in Leningrad, and told that when he went to technical university in St. Petersburg, they had separate classes for Muskovites and St. Petersburg students. They just don't get along. It's a fierce rivalry, where people from Moscow think they are the center of the universe, nobody else matters etc, and those in St. Petersburg consider themselves as the real capital of Russia, they think of themselves as European compared to the "Asian Muskovites" etc.

I mean these types of rivalries are very common in Europe, between the capital and other big cities. Most of it (at least over here) is just a bit of friendly banter and obviously sports, not to the level of having to separate the people in the same university based on their hometowns lol.
 
Conversely, given Ukraine is shitting all over the Russian capital virtually unopposed right now, they may not need to. Putin doesn't want to give up Crimea but given that's where this whole stupid thing started back in 2014, there is no greater humiliation than to kick that bald bastard's imperialist objectives right back to square one.

After all, all Ukraine wants is Russia to GTFO of the country, which legally includes Crimea, and they're really in the position of power that's only strengthening by the day. I would imagine the rest of the world would back this because it's known Russia pretty much supplied the missile system that killed that plane full of dutch doctors and tried to bury the evidence, to which Russia suffered no major reprecussions.
Many Russians nowadays consider Crimea to be part of the country proper, unlike the new self-proclaimed republics of DNR/LNR. Full scale operation by Ukraine to retake it could potentially give Putin justification to push for mobilization of even more people and resources. Albeit they've struck Kursk before, and all it did is got nork gooner army involved.
Speaking of which:

There's a bunch of new rumors speculating about new wave of mobilization as early as this October following State Duma elections. Supposedly, it's being discussed on all levels, but nothing has been decided. Worth noting that Putin's decree for mobilization in 2022 is still in force, and apparently they're trying to figure out how to sell another wave as "totally not mobilization", in order to limit backlash. Such rumors have been circulating ever since 2022, but it just intensified.
I simply doubt the feasibility of it, personally. From what I know, they're already struggling to supply soldiers in active service, what are they going to do with potential hundreds of thousands more? And it's unlikely to have any dramatic effect even if they do it, it will only further prolong the war at most - which I don't think would be worth the price.
What do you guys think?
 
Ostatnio edytowane:
While for the attacker close enough is good enough for whatever the drone, missile, kamikaze and etc. falls and explodes on if they get hit.
This very explicitly only works for large, indirect targets like apartment buildings and energy infrastructure, however.

Also warhead size and type. A 100kg teo-stage penetrator is going to need much higher accuracy than a 1000kg lolareaeffect blast or cluster munition.

Speaking of which, I heard that Russia has found some sort of jet turbine to strap to Geran drones, which could be an issue for the currently-quite-successful machine gun and interceptor drone based AA?
It cuts their range and ups the price, but yeah it makes it harder (albeit not impossible) to hit via AA gun. Also it forces dedicated AAs like Tunguskas and Gepards into the job rather than "twin Dishka mounted on the roof".

Interceptor drones work because of how slow and predictable Shaheds/Gerans fly.
Shaheds/Gerans aren't cheap because of Russo-Iranian military magic and BROOCS economic efficiency, they're cheap because they don't need to be good.
An interceptor drone would be hard-pressed to work against an actual cruise missile like a Tomahawk or Kalibr, but that's fine because they're made to cheaply intercept shitdrones like Gerans.

As the line between actual cruise missile and one-way attack drones continue to blur, so too will their advantages and disadvantages.
 
Putin's legacy hinges on Crimea. It’s a big trophy he's won for 10+ years. Russia isn't giving it up, and I don't see how Ukraine can take it from a logistics pov since Russia can do the same attacks on Ukraine, leave their troops stranded and open for slaughter. At most they can stop the Russian offensive and cut off Crimea from gas which seems to working well enough. Ukraine lacks manpower to retake Crimea and will focus on retaking inland territory.
They can basically besiege it and make life as uncomfortable as possible for the muscovites.
 
They can basically besiege it and make life as uncomfortable as possible for the muscovites.
Yeah I'm thinking they know he ain't giving it up and unless they've got some ace of the sleeve they're going to be content just constantly fucking it up and creating enormous resource costs and loss of Rusnigger izzat.

Maybe like @Ghostse is saying that they're gonna do some thunder run but seems like everything is pointing to momentum being on the hohol side while the Russians continue to advance at snail's pace to take yet another pointless fucking village so why not just throw more drones at everything and making life as miserable as possible, especially as production ramps up on your bigger boomers and more and more jets start trickling in.

Just have to hope that Putin doesn't call Trump crying, like a bitch, and saying okay for realsies this time that we can sort something out now as long as he sends Vance, Kushner and Witkoff to sort it out, no one else okay?
 
Many Russians nowadays consider Crimea to be part of the country proper, unlike the new self-proclaimed republics of DNR/LNR. Full scale operation by Ukraine to retake it could potentially give Putin justification to push for mobilization of even more people and resources. Albeit they've struck Kursk before, and all it did is got nork gooner army involved.
I don't think what the common Russian thinks matters here, since Putin outright doesn't respect Ukraine having a right to exist as a country, so it's kind of the same mentality.

The key thing is that the annexation was illegal, not recognized by basically anybody in the west, and there are a lot of international strangleholds on the Russian economy from those same powers. Russia needs to be put in its place so it doesn't try this stupid shit again and forcing them to give up something that legally never belonged to them for the past 12 years is a bargaining chip for there to be any hope of unfucking sanctions.
 
Putin's legacy hinges on Crimea. Its a big trophy he's won for 10+ years. Russia isn't giving it up, and I don't see how Ukraine can take it from a logistics pov since Russia can do the same attacks on Ukraine, leave their troops stranded and open for slaughter. At most they can stop the Russian offensive and cut off Crimea from gas which seems to working well enough. Ukraine lacks manpower to retake Crimea and will focus on retaking inland territory.
just to provide counter argument, because I have the same issues (plus any sort of thunder run would require a breakout from Kherson or bypassing the defenders making it take longer and leaving your logistics dangerously exposed) but:
If Ukraine does this with say, less than a week before major operations end, that would leave Russia with no hope for shifting forces for a major counter offensive and in theory with things moving towards peace they wouldn't need to worry about getting picked apart like they are doing to the russians.

edit: forgot to add: Ukraine has no significant sealift capabilities. They could send Marine teams on zodiacs to those marches on the west for PR strunts, but they do no have the ability to land equipment, to say nothing of Russian drones hungry for targets. Over the Dnepier is the only viable route for mechanized assault.

Speaking of which, I heard that Russia has found some sort of jet turbine to strap to Geran drones, which could be an issue for the currently-quite-successful machine gun and interceptor drone based AA?
Yes but no, no but yes, and yes.

Russia has demoed jet-powered Gerans, they've been spotted in the wild. But in additon to points about increased costs, the guidance on the gerans is not up to running something jet powered, and you have to change how the control interface works; turbines are less good about being set to "idle". basically everyting from the engine to the electronics is more expensive.


As for gun based AA:
anything less than 20mm is straight fucked. Really anything less than 40mm unless you're really pumping rounds. but while they are faster than prop driven drones they aren't any more durable and infact under more strain from the speeds its more likely damage becomes catastrophic.
It definitelymakes things harder, but most CRAM are up to tracking missile. To put that more on point: they aren't super sonic, so anything automated shouldn't have too much of a problem. Anything manual could have problems with untrained crews - and pretty much everyone's crews will be untrained for jet drones.
But NVA got most of their kills on American jets with ground gun-based AA.

Interceptor drones:
difficulty of interception raised dramatically. You have all the issues with handling increase speed as the drone, but now you need something able to figure target speed and plot intercept course. There are things you can do, like use swarms with impact triggers, but that's its own level of problems.

It cuts their range and ups the price, but yeah it makes it harder (albeit not impossible) to hit via AA gun. Also it forces dedicated AAs like Tunguskas and Gepards into the job rather than "twin Dishka mounted on the roof".

Interceptor drones work because of how slow and predictable Shaheds/Gerans fly.
Shaheds/Gerans aren't cheap because of Russo-Iranian military magic and BROOCS economic efficiency, they're cheap because they don't need to be good.
An interceptor drone would be hard-pressed to work against an actual cruise missile like a Tomahawk or Kalibr, but that's fine because they're made to cheaply intercept shitdrones like Gerans.

As the line between actual cruise missile and one-way attack drones continue to blur, so too will their advantages and disadvantages.
Pretty much this.

OPEC+ akshually.
fair point.

they're really in the position of power that's only strengthening by the day.
I think that's overstating things a bit. Ukraine is still being nibbled to death in Donetsk and can't really stop it - they are making it even more eyewatering costly than normal for Russia, but Russia gives no fucks about its soldiers only territory taken and is willing to feed in as many mobliks as it takes.
They are pressuring Russia every where else they can, but even the ZipZap counter offensive is likewise nibbling - the fact they rolled Russia back to almost 2024 lines is more a testament to how slow Russia has advanced than any sort of metric of a successful campaign.

Fucking Russia's economy extra hard to the point the population is Noticing(tm) and malding is only a power move if it translates to the government needing to end the war; it would be in the west where people can pressure the government, but Putin is still dictator with control of the media and sweeping arrest powers over a disarmed population.
The mouth peices allowed to have the microphones want MORE war not less as we saw from the malding posted here.
 
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